Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

[StukaJU87]

1994 Toyota 4x4 pickup. V6-5spd. Recently this problem started. Sometimes when I am at a stop and I put it in gear, I start letting the clutch out and it pops out into neutral. This sometimes happens with third gear too. Not all the time. But enough to worry me. I baby this thing and always have. I refuse to believe the trans is shot at 110,000 miles. Any ideas? [img]/images/graemlins/help.gif[/img]

[LouSiffer]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

I used to be a certified tech for Toyota, Nissan and BMW.....it sounds to my like a couple of things could be the culprit.

1: The tranny mount is shot allowing the tranny to move and bump itself out of gear.

2: The shifting forks and/or syncronizers are shot. It would be cheaper to just pick one up at a salvage yard and replace it. The parts are about $250-$350 bucks plus labor....that would be about $400-500 for removal and tear down.
-Lou

[StukaJU87]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

Thanks Lou. Not really what I wanted to hear. I just sprang for timing belt, water pump, thermostat, belts etc etc.

[LouSiffer]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

Sorry Stuka.....Those are usually the 2 things that cause this problem. If it is the tranny mount....its not big deal....under a hundred usually.

Unfortunately, to me it sounds more like the more expensive of the 2. You shift, but due to shifting forks or synchs being worn, it does not engage fully allowing it to pop out of gear......especially under medium to hard acceleration. Sometimes you can throw it into gear harder and it helps a little. -Lou

[Newc]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

...which none of those things affect the condition of the mount or shifting forks and such [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
That's like saying "I can't have a flat tire, I just had it washed" [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

Newc

[Reverend Timmy]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

Stuka,I agree with Lou.I was a Toyota Tech for 4 years before I went to work in the tire and rubber industry.Sounds like the syncro is gone.Lou covered all the bases ,really not gonna know until you tear it down.I did see it happen more in the 5spd than the 4spd. Rev.Timmy

[StukaJU87]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

[ QUOTE ]
...which none of those things affect the condition of the mount or shifting forks and such [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
That's like saying "I can't have a flat tire, I just had it washed" [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/poke.gif[/img]

Newc

[/ QUOTE ] No sh1t Sherlock. I was speaking from a financial perspective. Jeez. Newc, don't assume everyone is as stupid as you think. I know a thing or two about mechanics, just not transmissions.

[kremit]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

[ QUOTE ]
Stuka,I agree with Lou.I was a Toyota Tech for 4 years before I went to work in the tire and rubber industry.Sounds like the syncro is gone.Lou covered all the bases ,really not gonna know until you tear it down.I did see it happen more in the 5spd than the 4spd. Rev.Timmy

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly. That and the fact that it happens in the forward positions (1 & 3) would, in my mind, make it almost certain to be a problem with the synchronizers.

[Chuckracer]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question

My '94 22RE 4x4 did the same thing in first and third. I'm a big chicken and sold the truck!

[StukaJU87]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

I called around to a couple places to get quotes. They both told me that to R&R the trans would be $800 plus parts. And they both told me that the parts are only available from Toyota and are expensive. One guy told me the whole job will be about $2000.

That same guy asked me when was the last time I changed the fluid on it, and I told him about 80,000 miles ago. He told me I should try a fluid change with this new gear oil called Synchromesh. He thinks it may do the trick since the gear box isn't crapped out totally yet. I will do this Wednesday and see what happens. Ugh......I hate this crap.

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

$800 to R&R the trans and install a clutch in that? JUST for labor?? Plus a buying clutch kit, bearings and the unit? Wow... That is sorta high.

New Jersey? I can't imagine charging more the than 350-450 to do that and that is VERY good money for that job in the Cleveland area. Lotsa guys would do that on their back for 250-300 here...

I truly don't think going GM Synchromesh will help you. I suppose it's somehow possible that it might, but honestly don't think so.

Best is to source a low mileage used init from a salvage yard. We get a lot from out west, and get some cherry units for good prices.

For a reman 89-94 W-56-L (22RE), you could get the 4x4 one for about $900.

Used, I'm thinking around $400 (give or take)...

If it is a late 94-95 Tacoma 4cyl, it's probably gonna be a W-59. Remans are around $1200 for them. Used say likely $400+ I'll have to make some calls to be sure.

If you decide to source a used one, I could call a couple of my places and see exactly what one could be had for, and turn you onto it. Of course there is truck frieght shipping costs involved to your location etc.

Beware of someone wanting to rebuild it, as manual parts can are expensive sometimes, and typically someone may offer to build it for $250+ parts, BUT, it's the parts that will make it expensive to rebuild. You can source a low mileage cutout, or a reman from a vendor for less usually.

[StukaJU87]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

I searched on the web for a reman trans and couldn't find any for a 94 4x4 5spd. I will look some more. It's not a Tacoma. Just a short bed DX Pickup. I am gonna try the fluid change but more than likely I will need to replace it. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

http://www.marlincrawler.com/trans.html

[StukaJU87]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

Thanks for that link. Sounds pretty reasonable compared to what I have been hearing around here. I saved it. 900 bucks all of a sudden doesn't sound too bad.

[Razor]

Re: Auto Mechanics HELP 5 spd question *UPDATE*

Stuka...first of all. I'm a tranny guy, have been for eight years. First of all, the problems with first and third are not related. The synchronizer hub-sleeve-blocking rings for first are also for second. The snychronizer hub-sleeve-blocking rings for third are also for fourth. So, you have a 1-2 shift fork that moves the 1-2 synchronizer assembly, and a 3-4 shift fork that moves the 3-4 synchronizer assembly.

Now, does it pop out of gear in first as soon as you pull out? Or does it never quite seem to go into gear when you put it in first. If it never quite seems to go into gear you could be looking at a clutch release problem (i.e. worn out clutch assembly or a hydraulic problem with the clutch slave and master cylinder). But that's a long shot.

Parts for the Toyota's (you should have an AX-5 or AX-15 tranny) are available aftermarket, and a good tranny guy can find good used parts, or aftermarket new parts for half the cost of brand new ones from Toyota. In my opinion reasonable remove, inspect, rebuild, and reinstall labor should be around $600.00 give or take $50.00. Also, keep in mind that if you buy the used unit for $900.00, you'll still have somewhere around $400.00 in labor, fluid, shipping and misc.

Since standard tranny's are still brute force technology, you only have to replaced the bad/worn out parts. Although I highly recommend biting the bullet and installing a bearing and seal kit.

First recommendation from Razor, get a good mechanic to diagnose the truck and tell you what type of repair you need. Most decent mechanics won't even charge to check a standard because they're so easy to diagnose.

Couple of places I use.

High Gear Transmissions - 800-323-6211 - Ask for Scott - The guys here know their ****. Best I've ever dealt with. Killer pricing too!

Adcock Transmissions - 270-531-1552 or 800-550-4615 - This place is straight up also.