Hunters

[Deneb]

I'm looking into buying a rifle. I've hunted before, and I've gotten opinions from several people, but I'd like some input from you guys.

Right now, I plan on deer hunting, and occasionally wasting a few varmints. I understand if you're specifically into shooting varmints, you buy a varmint rifle, but I just want to do it to poke some holes in shit, nothing as serious, as I'd like to take it when I'd be hunting deer.

I'm looking at a few different guns.

Tikka White Tail Hunter 300 Mag (I'm thinking no, because 300 mags are expensive to reload) for 475. No sights, scope mounts, anything.

Weatherby (*any rifle caliber pretty much) with a decent (by decent, I mean good for what I'd use it for) scope, sights, case. 500$

Remington 700ADL either 270 or 30-06, 329$, no scope.

I'm leaning towards a 270 or 30-06, and even closer to a 270. With a 270, I can still have some knock down power, AND accuracy, where as the 30-06, I don't see me doing 1 inch groups at 200 yards.

I'm of course open to ANY opinions on what caliber and make, but even though I've got the money, I don't want to spend more than 300-600$ on the gun/scope.

So, with that said, people help me out!

[83REDCHARVEL]

Re: Hunters

As an avid hunter, gun owner and part owner of a gun shop, I can tell you ther is no such thing as 'knock down power'.A .270 is a good all around caliber but it has a very high velocity and does alot of damage to an animal.So you get less to eat and more to throw away.If you want something to use as an all around rifle I would choose a .243 as it can be loaded down to a 55 grain bullet for small animals and can be loaded up to 130 grain bullets for bigger game like deer. Remington make a great gun .I own several and have never had any problems. Where do you live? What kind of deer do you plan on hunting? Also what kind of land are you hunting on, flat, hilly lots of canyons,I only ask because you will need the best setup for you. I will be happy to help. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] P.S. it's nice to see someone else that like to killem and eatum.

[Deneb]

Re: Hunters

Well for deer, I don't want to fuck them up to bad to ruin them. For varmints, I just want to watch shit explode :P

I live in PA. Probably wooded areas, with some openings, but there would probably be some brush. I would need to be able to make a good load that if I had to rip through some brush, the bullet would not deviate too terribly bad.

[the_drip]

Re: Hunters

I have a 25-06. It was awesome, I haven't shot it in over 6 years though. I liked it better than the 30-06 our family also has. Both are Bolt Action. Winchesters I think. I"m not sure anymore. They are with my dad in Montana.

[Overlord]

Re: Hunters

Deneb,

Firearms are just as subjective as guitars. Everyone has their favorite brands, styles and calibers. Generally, you won't go wrong choosing a rifle by Remington, Ruger, Winchester or Weatherby. You just have to find out what "fits" and if you are satisfied with the location of the safety and other controls.

As for caliber selection, it depends on which subspecies of deer your are hunting. It also depends on the possibility that you could hunt larger animals later. You mentioned a 300 Mag first, that would work wonderfully for Mule Deer, Elk, Moose, Bear etc. It would be expensive overkill for varmints. A 270 or 30-06 are both very versatile, with the 270 being the minimum caliber I would consider for Elk. The 30-06 is probably the most versatile caliber in existence, but not as flat shooting as the 270. When you mentioned the Weatherby, I am assuming you are referring to the Vanguard line that uses "regular" as opposed to "Weatherby Ammunition". Cartridges for "Weatherby Magnums" are usually twice as expensive as standard cartridges.

It would be hard to find a rifle anywhere close to your price range that would consistently shoot 1" groups at 200 yds. 1" to 1.5" groups at 100 yds are the norm for "off the shelf " rifles.

That being said, here are my thoughts. Judging by the prices you listed, you are looking at used rifles. This can be really dicey unless you know what you are looking for. I would consider a new rifle. The best deal out there right now (IMO) is the Weatherby Vanguard, you can get a blued synthetic for less than $400 from Walmart. Stainless synthetic is a bit less than $500. If you want a rifle built in USA, than I would take a look at the Remington 700 in ADL or BDL. They are more than the Vanguard, but not by an excessive amount. I would recommend getting it chambered in 270. Use 130 grain bullets for deer and varmints, the recoil is light in case you shoot a lot of ammo. You can always step up to 150 grain bullets if you get the chance to hunt for elk. Personally, I prefer the 7mm Rem Magnum, but that is also overkill for varmints.

The next hard part is scopes, to a point, you get what you pay for. You can get a scope for $30 to $40, but I wouldn't recommend any scope in that price range. I believe the best value currently for price versus quality is between Burris, Nikon and Leupold. Generally consider a 3-9 power with a starting price of about $200 - $250. All three of those brands have entry level scopes that will be in this price range, of course they will also have top of the line scopes that will be five times that price. Most larger sporting goods stores will have a selection of scopes to compare. I chose Nikon, you may decide you like Burris the best.

Hopefully this will help answer you questions, remember these are just my opinions. Be sure to lets us know how the hunt goes this year! [img]/images/graemlins/headbang.gif[/img]

[Overlord]

Re: Hunters

Dang...four posts in the time it took to write my response! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[Deneb]

Re: Hunters

All guns I mentioned are new, not used. All but the Remington are guaranteed for accuracy. Yes, it is the Vangard line.

I understand the get what you pay for mindset on the scope. I'm thinking for around 100 I can find something I like.

The Weatherby I mentioned, it's right around the walmart price from the gunshop I'd go to. They give you a gas rebate for driving there, and I'm getting a Bushnell 3X9X40 scope with it, a case and some other crap. I looked in the stores catalog and the scope is an 85$ one. So it's not junk from the box, but it's by no means a Leupold Target grade one. The guy said, if you want a cheap good scope, buy a Tasco something or other it was like 40 bucks. He said for putting down a deer within close distances, is reasonable with it. He also said "you're probably going to want to spend a few more bucks and get a decent scope, don't ask me, ask anyone who shoots". As you said, I'm leaning with the 270 or 30-06

I wasn't saying that off of the shelf I wanted to shoot those groups, I'm saying I probably won't be able to shoot those groups, if that makes sense.

One of the guns I was looking at was the 700 ADL for 329$, I could get it in 243, 270 or 30-06. My opinion is changing by the hour, but I'm thinking either this or the weatherby in 270.

7mm appeals to me, because my insane uncle used to use one. I would ask him, but as I said, he's a bit insane now. My friend Ryan also hunts with a 7mm. All he says though is this " I only know this gun, and this is the only gun I've ever killed with." Referring to a Sako (I believe) with a Leupold on it.

Thanks for the advice, I'll be sure to post pics of whatever I get, and then hopefully when hunting season comes around (they've fucked up the deer in PA pretty good) hopefully I've got something else.

As for varmint, I just want to make holes and kill things.

[STLKINGV]

Re: Hunters

I'll chime in.... I own a Steyer Diamler .243 with a 26" barrel, that does everything that I've asked it to do. Double lung shot at 200-yds with a Hornady (sp.) light mag loads. I don't eat the ribs anyway. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Adrian

[LesPaulCustom]

Re: Hunters

7mm Rem Mag [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Yeah, it is clipping right along at almost 3K FPS but hits like a freight train [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

I think it's more versatile than a 30-06 and flatter than a .270 Win (baby 30-06 [img]/images/graemlins/eviltongue.gif[/img])

The .257 Roberts is a great round.

For rifles, it's hard to beat a Browning A-Bolt with factory BOSS installed [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

That is what my 7mm MAG is in, and I can get sub 1" groups at 200 yards with it consistantly w/cold barrel.

For larger critters (AKA the ones that get really irritated when shot, like Bears, Moose etc.) I'd definitely say minimum .35 Cal, preferably Magnum.

I have a .35 Whelen in a Remington Classic that I handload for, and it will stop a charging Rhino lol [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

It is basically a baby .338 Win Mag using handloads....it upended a 1200lb + Bull Moose on it's hind hooves and broke/shattered a 550 lb black bears front shoulders [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img] (note, the fugger still tried to eat me!! Imma done with bears)

[HuntinDoug]

Re: Hunters

I've been a hunter for years...(thus the name "HuntinDoug"). Hunting has moved from being a sport, to a lifestyle. Over the past we'll say 10 years, I have seen the "weekend warrior" hunters increase like rabbits. Here in OH we have deer bow season that lasts from Oct 4 to Jan 31. Deer gun season (shotgun, single slug only) lasts for 1 week. It starts right after Thanksgiving. Usually the first, and last days of the season are the worst. In those two days, you get the guys who "just gotta kill sumpin'". It's scary. I can't tell you how glad I am that OH doesn’t allow high-powered rifles. Put a 30-06 in the hand of one of those "weekend warriors", and someone's gonna get shot. I haven’t really gun hunted in 5 years or so.

OK...enough of that. My point is that if you are looking to have some occasional fun...just be careful, and know who else is hunting the land you are on. If you want a real challenge, buy a bow. Bow season is much quieter...no gunshots, less hunters in the woods. You see the deer in more of a natural setting. I’ve seen foxes, coyotes, owls, and other animals while bow hunting. And, you can’t take a pop at a deer that’s 200 yards away when you’re bow hunting.

[Deneb]

Re: Hunters

Doug, when I talk about shooting varmint just to kill shit, I'm talking about the ground hogs that tear up crops, not people.

Believe me, the people I'd shoot wouldn't be with a hunting rifle, and it wouldn't be in the woods :P Then again, jail isn't worth shooting these people, and it's easier to go through life, just knowing they are dumb asses and laughing at them.

More seriously, I don't plan on going into the woods, just to wax a deer. Before my uncle went insane, he took it seriously. My other uncle, I don't talk to at all, because of his current habits, but before, he used to religiously be in the woods. My girlfriends dad is a hunter, as is my friend Ryan and about every male in his family. When I was younger, with my uncle I took a hunter safety course (kind of neat actually, even if you're not a hunter) and know to be safe.

what I'm getting at in a nutshell is, if I shoot a deer, it's to eat it. If I shoot a varmint, it's for the fuck of it. I'm not talking shit on bow hunters at all, but I'm not into it at this point in life (then again, before i wasn't into gun hunting, even though everyone around me did it.)

If our deer gun season was shot gun, single shot slug only, hell I'd be set already. I've got a nice (not great, but it's a dead on gun) NEF 12 guage, full choke, single shot break away. You point the business end of the barrel at something, and at 50 yards, it's pretty spot on. Using game loads it keeps the group tight, so it would make a good turkey gun.

The main consensus I talk to is still right in the 30-06/270 area. It seems everyone I talk to that says 30-06, one says 270. Occasionally I get someone who mentions something different. My girlfriends dad tells me "a 30-06 will be a good all around gun for you". My uncle used a 7mm, my other uncle a 243. Ryans dad uses a 243 or 25-06.

One thing I'm getting from almost everyone though, is take a look at what you're buying first, to make sure it's not going to be a fortune to shoot. That Tikka is a great price, but 300 mag shells aren't going to be very affordable to reload, and unless I find a load quick that's consistent, then I'm going to be spending A LOT.

Thanks for the advice. Also nice to see we've got some hunters here, and I'm REALLY suprised no one has made a Nuge comment. :P

[STLKINGV]

Re: Hunters

"Happiness is a warm gut pile"~ Predator Tedator (nuge)
[img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/notworthy.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[HuntinDoug]

Re: Hunters

[img]/images/graemlins/eyes.gif[/img] OK...Maybe I came across wrong...Sorry, didn’t mean it to if I did. What I mean is be careful of the other people who are shooting in the woods. (IE) DONT GET SHOT! I didn’t mean it like you were gonna buy a gun, and shoot everything in sight.

Every year in OH we have at least one or two incidents of people getting killed by other hunters. Last year a 15 year old kid got shot by his dad...tragic. His dad's comment was "I thought I heard a deer in the brush, so I shot at it". We have "Hunters Safety" courses here. They are mandatory. If you don't pass the course, you don’t get your license. Apparently the poor kid’s dad didn’t pay attention.

I used to hunt rabbit, duck, goose & other stuff. But I narrowed it down to deer hunting cause that's what I love. I keep about 1/4 of the meat for deer chili. The rest I donate to needy families. Some people wont eat deer. Personally I think every person who eats meat should have to (at some point in their lives) kill, dress, prepare, and consume an animal. It kills me how some people will not eat meat unless it is wrapped in plastic & has a price tag on it.

Anyway..... Good luck with your gun purchase. [img]/images/graemlins/toast.gif[/img] I hope you find the one that suits your needs.

[npacheco]

Re: Hunters

If you're looking for THE deer rifle...Winchester Model 94 (lever action) in 30-30Win. I love mine. I have a Winchester Model 67 in .308Win that I use for elk. If the area you hunt is heavily wooded, don't put a scope on it. If it is mildly wooded, then a 2X-4X power scope should do.

Like was stated earlier, different strokes for different folks. It's all subjective.

I have to vote for the Modle 94 in 30-30Win, though. It is by far my favorite gun (I have the .308, two .22s, 12 guage, and 30-06).

Just my $0.02

[Deneb]

Re: Hunters

I'm thinking it's the Weatherby Vanguard in 30-06, with the Bushnell Banner 3X9X40 scope and case for 500$ [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]