RANT - So I get this email....

[hippietim]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

Has it been 3 months already? Time for another Newc rant about why his "creations" aren't valued as much as he thinks they are.

I saw that Explorer. Dude, it looks pretty bad. At first as I was scrolling through the auction I was thinking it looked pretty cool. Then you look closely. Then you see the back. It looks like crap man. There are Gibson Explorers in very nice condition going for not much more than your asking price.

You've got some great guitars and you've done some cool stuff in the Newcenstein lab. They ain't all treasures though - if they were you'd be keeping them.

As always Newc, you can't expect that your guitars will hold their value just because it cost you more time and/or money to get it in that state.

[YetAnotherOne]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

I have to ask: when is an offer insulting and why is any offer ever insulting? I honestly don't understand that. It seems to me that there's no real problem so long as one is able say, "Thanks for the offer but I'll pass because ...."

[Ace]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

Newc, I think you are wrong. Please post pictures of all of your guitars so that I can tell you what's wrong with them and EXACTLY what you need to do to them to make them to my liking. You have no choise in the matter. I will expect notarized pictures of your repaired guitars in stock form within 30 days or your guitar owning license will be revoked.

[img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[Ace]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

[ QUOTE ]
I have to ask: when is an offer insulting and why is any offer ever insulting? I honestly don't understand that. It seems to me that there's no real problem so long as one is able say, "Thanks for the offer but I'll pass because ...."

[/ QUOTE ]

An example of an insulting offer:

"Hey buddy, I'll trade you my 1985 Hondo for a night with your wife".

[YetAnotherOne]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

LOL - Point taken Ace but if we limit the discussion to offers of gear or cash for gear is there really such a thing as an insulting offer? I've had members here, ones that have been around a while, offer me trades that were worth 25%-30% of what I was offering for sale but I don't find that insulting at all. Merely informative.

[Cleveland Metal]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I have to ask: when is an offer insulting and why is any offer ever insulting? I honestly don't understand that. It seems to me that there's no real problem so long as one is able say, "Thanks for the offer but I'll pass because ...."

[/ QUOTE ]

An example of an insulting offer:

"Hey buddy, I'll trade you my 1985 Hondo for a night with your wife".

[/ QUOTE ]


How about that guitar for a night with my "EX"-wife???

[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[YetAnotherOne]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

You guys should really be nicer to Newc. At least he's generally experimenting on imports and not $3k custom shop jobs. "... the way it should have come from Gibson in the first place." [img]/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif[/img]

[neilli]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

I agree with Newc in as much as "if you don't want to pay my price, or at least something close to it, don't hassle me as I ain't going to sell it for 40% of what it's advertised for"

However, ultimately, in most cases, a modded guitar will only get more or less the going rate for the non-modded version (i.e. you don't get your money back)....I guess this works unless you put an OFR and EMGs in a $200 hondo!

[Newc]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

It's not really a question of getting my money back that I've put out, it's more a question of someone telling me that they have absolutely no concern for the money I've put out, ackowledging that it's entirely my loss (to which I agree), but at the same time making an offer that reflects their concern for the amount of money they foresee putting out to change whatever they want to their personal preference. They are not accepting that such expense is entirely THEIR loss, yet they're asking me to have some consideration for their loss. I don't get it [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]

Why even bother with a guitar that has been modified so extensively just to have it modified even more extensively to "restore" it? And don't let the term "restoration" fool you - restoring something usually entails twice as much work and cost as getting it that way to begin with.
I mean, as was stated, there's tons available in unmodded condition for the same price, but to buy one that would need a complete resurfacing (we're talking fairly heavy duty vinyl decals under poly, so it ain't coming off with a hair dryer and peanut butter), just to paint it a solid color?!

And who would buy a WRMG body that had literally thousands of tiny holes in it PLUS a dozen drilled holes in it just to spend MORE money having the holes filled and then repainted, when you can just look up MetalMusic80s on Ebay and buy one that only has a few swirls and maybe a chipped tip? [img]/images/graemlins/scratchhead.gif[/img]
On the other hand, if you want to avoid the $100 in hardware PLUS the 8 hours of your day to mount hundreds of Metal spikes and studs to a guitar ON TOP of the cost of a guitar, the cost of a replacement neck AND the time it took to modify the heel to fit a regular Jackson neck pocket, AND you want a razor thin maple-boarded neck, AND you want an OFR, AND a hardshell case, then I've got just what you're looking for. If you see it as needing a resurfacing, you're shopping in the wrong spot.

Basically my main question is: If you don't like it as-is, why are you even asking about it when there are others that are more readily available, closer to your personal liking, and would ultimately cost you less to make it "perfect" for you?

I could give the Explorer away for free and unless you had the tools and materials on-hand to completely redo the whole thing (including a refret OR replacing the fretboard), it'd cost you more or as much as one that was closer to the condition/appearance you prefer.
If you DO have the tools and materials on-hand, then the question of how much you'd be out is irrelevant IMO, because it's not costing you more than you've already put out for those tools and materials which you already own.

I'll tell you what - head on down to your local clothing shop and grab something off the rack that you don't like, and haggle the price with them explaining that you'd have to spend extra money to have it reworked to suit you.
Then go down to a car dealership and haggle over the money you'd hafta spend to turn a Ford Probe into a Chevy Impala.

As for the guy with the Iommi SG - That pretty much goes along with my point: Don't buy an Iommi SG and put EMGs in it. Buy any other SG and put EMGs in it. He basically paid $3000 for Iommi Cross inlays. Reboarding, refinishing, and inlaying a Faded SG Special would have been what, $350-$500 tops with the EMGs?

[hippietim]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

...and go down to the grocery store and hagle over the money you'd have to spend to turn a turnip into cheddar cheese.

First you have to buy a farm. Then you have to buy a cow. Then you have to feed that fucking cow the turnip. Then you have to milk the cow. Then you have to whatever it takes to make the fucking cheese.

I finally see your point.

[Jim Shine]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

[ QUOTE ]
I have to ask: when is an offer insulting and why is any offer ever insulting? I honestly don't understand that. It seems to me that there's no real problem so long as one is able say, "Thanks for the offer but I'll pass because ...."

[/ QUOTE ]

How about when you have a guitar worth a minimal $1500. A well known collector or flipper 'in the know' contacts you telling you it is only worth $800 tops, but since they are willing to 'bail you out', they will pay that $800 dollar price? That insults my intelligence.

[shreddermon]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

Jim - Bad experience trying to sell the roundhorn? I saw the bidders, some of whom are notorious. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Newc - The bottom line is this: often times Dr. Newcenstein's mods devalue a guitar. Sorry, bro, but that's the reality. Nonetheless, the Explorer offer was totally cheesy anyway.

[Jim Shine]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

No probs selling the roundhorn actually (and it was a bit more than my $1500 example). Note I never listed it here, so I didn't open that door. I think people were scared to lowball me on that one. In the end it went to a friend who is also a member of this board, just like I would have preferred it to go.

I was basing my example on past experience with a couple of really cool ones I had.

[shreddermon]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

Ah. Glad to hear that. A certain bidder on it just caught my eye, that's all. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] That V is a very cool one for sure. Congrats to the new owner.

[Newc]

Re: RANT - So I get this email....

Shred - I understand that some people feel that way, but that's why I asked "Why bother with it if you don't like it?"
Obviously no one had what I wanted readily available, and a Custom Shop was out of the question. The only logical choice for me was to buy one and have it done at a later date.
Now, why would anyone buy mine to change it into something different, or restore it? It makes no sense when there are "blanker canvases" out there already.