Gross!!

[Chad]

I worked in the insurance business for almost 8 years.....it seemed the problems always rooted back to the legal profession.

Attornies sue for everything....insurance rates go up. Insurance goes up.....medical costs go up. Medical costs go up and employers or individuals can't afford the insurance. Wages either go down to pay for the insurance or worse yet companies drop insurance. As wages go down or employees have to pay for their own personal insurance, they can't afford to buy the things they normally would. This hurts the economy. But no matter what the insurance company gets the majority of the blame because it's "trendy" to hate insurance companies. Be cool. Be different. Don't be a sheep. Love insurance.

[Top Jimmy B]

[SeventhSon]

BTW, here's my Day 1 report.

One shit so far. Nothing unusual or worth taking pictures of.

[fr0sty]

I do not believe there is a evil medical conspiracy to keep you sick so "they" can steal your $$$ Traditional medicine is tested and has known effects (both intended and unintended). Those effects have been shown to be caused by the meds or treatment. It's how the scientific method works. "Alternative" therapies never seem to do the proper double blind studies to find out if their cures are real or not. Much of it is likely placebo effect. Some may not but, but dammit, do the studies!

"So and so" did "xyz and now their (insert incurable disease here) has vanished!" is not evidence that xyz caused the disease to vanish. Alternative medicine practitioners should put up or shut up. Do the studies and show their treatments work.

There is no alternative medicine. Either treatments work or they don't.

If you don't believe that the "traditional" medical community exists to keep you sick, i've got a bridge to sell you. pharma companies are like cigarette companies. Their wet dream is to get you addicted to one of their expensive drugs for as long as possible. Basically legal addictive drugs. Then they provide kick backs to the doctors to push them onto you. Look at oxycontin, et. al. Have you noticed how many doctors try to sell you shit now? They might as well sew on the drug companies logo on their doctor's smock.

As I said in a previous post, I was diagnosed with acid reflux laryngitis. i got prescribed nexium which helped tremendously but costs $400 for a 60 day supply. how long am i supposed to take this? according to the literature, for the rest of my life! lol. You think they'll ever spend any money on research to actually find a cure?! lmao.

you should see what lengths the drug companies go to in order to undermine vitamin C research and call it quackery.

I don't know if this stuff is quackery or not. But I would view such opinions from the "medical" community with skepticism. They have a vested interest in making people believe it's quackery.

[fr0sty]

Yeah, frosty posted that link about 5 days ago, dude!

mmmm, mucoid plaque

[m2pmd70]

Yeah, frosty posted that link about 5 days ago, dude!

No shit (haha)? I double-checked the whole thread and still missed it. "My bad" as the kids say.

[Bert]

you should see what lengths the drug companies go to in order to undermine vitamin C research and call it quackery.

There's little evidence that Vitamin C (or most other vitamins & minerals for that matter) do anything *at all* if you already have a decent diet. Several double-blind studies have established this, most conducted by universities with nothing to gain from such an outcome. Pretty much all vitamin therapy and herbal supplements are the equivalent of snake oil.

As for the super colon blow equivalents, you're high if you think they can rid you of parasites. Sure it can help cure the occasional bout of constipation, but if you take it for a long period, you're risking turning a temporary condition into a chronic one. But hey, good luck with that! :ROTF:

[toejam]

Pretty much all vitamin therapy and herbal supplements are the equivalent of snake oil.

Just like chiropractors are not real doctors, right?

[SeventhSon]

I do not believe there is a evil medical conspiracy to keep you sick so "they" can steal your $$$ Traditional medicine is tested and has known effects (both intended and unintended). Those effects have been shown to be caused by the meds or treatment. It's how the scientific method works. "Alternative" therapies never seem to do the proper double blind studies to find out if their cures are real or not. Much of it is likely placebo effect. Some may not but, but dammit, do the studies!

"So and so" did "xyz and now their (insert incurable disease here) has vanished!" is not evidence that xyz caused the disease to vanish. Alternative medicine practitioners should put up or shut up. Do the studies and show their treatments work.

There is no alternative medicine. Either treatments work or they don't.

Hey, my dad is an M.D., an ENT to be exact + teaches at the VA hospital, and he's the one that's been telling me this. If you don't think there is a quid pro quo in prescribing drugs, well, there's nothing i can do. He happens to be a devout Catholic so he doesn't go down this road. Ever notice how many times you've been prescribed antibiotics when the doctor damn well knows it's not going to help you? In fact, it's likely to cause you more harm than good? Ka-ching!

Regarding research into non-pharmco treatments, "so and so" would be Linus Pauling, a nobel prize winner, who did research on the efficacy of vitamin C on the common cold. There's this privately published research paper that's been popular among the medical profession that shows all the legitimate research he and others did on vitamin C and all the subsequent efforts by the drug companies to discredit the research.

Also, my neighbor is a VP for ICOS, the company that make Cialis. I asked him why marijuana is still illegal when it's efficacy has been proven, and he told me because there's no intellectual property that can be established with it so there's no money that can be made from it so the drug companies lobby for it to remain illegal so that they can come up with expensive drugs that counteract the side effects of chemo treatment.

I would suggest you read this: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...&sn=003&sc=870
and follow the links, especially this one: http://www.mercola.com/2002/mar/23/drug_companies.htm.

Now a lot of doctors believe in the hippocratic oath and do the right thing, but you have to find them. Don't go to a doctor without a strong referral. I've heard my dad talk to his doctor friends over drinks and after a few, they talk about doctors who are board certified that they would never send a patient to because of how incompetent they were in diagnosis, treatment, and surgical abilities. My high school buddy that's an anesthesiologist tells me the same thing about incompetent people who are board certified.

BTW, Harvard Medical school now endorses "alternative" treatments. http://www.bidmc.harvard.edu/display.asp?node_id=2609

[MBreinin]

I worked in the insurance business for almost 8 years.....it seemed the problems always rooted back to the legal profession.

Attornies sue for everything....insurance rates go up. Insurance goes up.....medical costs go up. Medical costs go up and employers or individuals can't afford the insurance. Wages either go down to pay for the insurance or worse yet companies drop insurance. As wages go down or employees have to pay for their own personal insurance, they can't afford to buy the things they normally would. This hurts the economy. But no matter what the insurance company gets the majority of the blame because it's "trendy" to hate insurance companies. Be cool. Be different. Don't be a sheep. Love insurance.

The insurance industry spans much more than medical insurance and insuring doctors.

Take a look at what is going on in the Gulf South right now if you would like a good look at how the insurance industry functions.

It is DESIGNED to retain money, not pay it out. Keep that in mind.

Let me give you a little example of how it works. Let's say you are in a car accident. You are injured and liability is clear. Now, you would think this would be an open and shut case, correct? No, that is not how it works.

First stage is attempting to settle with an insurance adjuster. Now, if the injury is not severe, this should be easy. Let's say you treat for 6 months. The adjuster should be able to handle this, correct? Generally, it is a give and take attempt with the adjuster. He lowballs you, you come back higher, etc. At some point you either decide to take less than you are entitled to, or you file suit. You are not going to get a fair settlement at this stage.

If you file suit, the adjuster is removed from the equation and in most cases, ouside counsel is brought in. Now, because the insurance industry does not want to set precedent that they will pay out, they will incur more in fees than the difference between what you wanted and what they wanted to give. Outside counsel, who generally bills by the hour (some are under flat rate contracts), does not want to settle this case quickly..how would they make money? So, they start racking up the hours with letters, phone calls, discovery, depositions and other mumbo-jumbo.

Once they have billed enough hours delaying the inevitable, which they would call exercising due dilligence for their client, they will start talking settlement...and lowball you just like the insurance company already did. So, time has gone on...fees have been cranked up and you are still basically in phase 1. If you and the defense counsel cannot reach an agreement, you will set it for trial. This will, of course, crank up the hours of preparation and the fees the insurance company gets billed. Preparing for a trial is long and tedious, and expensive. The insurance company would like to deter YOU from a trial, by outspending you.

Negotiations will continue, of course. If you still can't reach a resolution...you go on. Expect REAL settlement offers to be made on the eve of trial, or at trial. They don't want to lose and risk a bigger award than you were asking for. This is when most good settlements are made.

So, what has transpired? Instead of just paying a reasonable amount and resolving the case quickly, the insurance company threw every hurdle in your way, incurred more money in expenses than they would have paid out under a reasonable settlement, and ended up paying anyway.

They pass this expense on to policy holders.

It is all a crapshoot and a poker game. They want to blow you off for nothing, and they will spend the bucks to keep dealing the cards...even if they spend more in the end than in the beginning.

Big cases are even worse.

Mike

[MBreinin]

As for the super colon blow equivalents, you're high if you think they can rid you of parasites. :ROTF:

That is an herbal supplement that comes in pill form and is part of the program. The ingredients have been proven in double-blind clinical trials to eliminate parasites.

Mike

[SeventhSon]

Frosty, in today's news (free registration required):

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/04/bu...rtner=homepage

Doctors Object to Gathering of Drug Data

"Although virtually unknown to consumers, the information has long been considered the most potent weapon in pharmaceutical sales — computerized dossiers showing which physicians are prescribing what drugs. Armed with such data, a drug sales representative can pressure a doctor to write more prescriptions for a name-brand medicine or fewer orders for a competitor's drug."

[MBreinin]

Frosty, in today's news (free registration required):

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/04/bu...rtner=homepage

Doctors Object to Gathering of Drug Data

"Although virtually unknown to consumers, the information has long been considered the most potent weapon in pharmaceutical sales — computerized dossiers showing which physicians are prescribing what drugs. Armed with such data, a drug sales representative can pressure a doctor to write more prescriptions for a name-brand medicine or fewer orders for a competitor's drug."

They also target what they call "thought leaders" which are influencial doctors in their fields, and seek to have them prescribe a certain drug as well as speak in favor of the drug. There are many "incentives" to do this.

In Vioxx, Merck knew exactly who was prescribing Cox-II inhibitors, whose Coxibs they were prescribing, and if they were not prescribing these, what kinds of pain drugs they were prescribing. They conducted relentless campaigns with all doctors, phone calls, office visits, mail, fax...whatever it took to get doctors to prescribe Vioxx and to crush Celebrex.

They also used out and out intimidation to "neutralize" any thought leader who was anti-Vioxx.

Mike

[fr0sty]

Thanks for these links and the prior ones you posted. I will check them out. I have no doubt that some Docs are crappy and that the pharmaceutical co's want us to buy their products and that sucks. To me, that does not leave the alternative med practitioners off the hook.

I still stand by my earlier comments about alternative medicine practitioners who do NOT back up their remedies with the proper controlled studies. If th links you provide show measurable results, then that's great. Consumers need to know that and make smart choices. If not, consumers need to know that to, so they don't waste money and health chasing snake oil.

Frosty, in today's news (free registration required):

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/04/bu...rtner=homepage

Doctors Object to Gathering of Drug Data

"Although virtually unknown to consumers, the information has long been considered the most potent weapon in pharmaceutical sales — computerized dossiers showing which physicians are prescribing what drugs. Armed with such data, a drug sales representative can pressure a doctor to write more prescriptions for a name-brand medicine or fewer orders for a competitor's drug."

[YetAnotherOne]

That is an herbal supplement that comes in pill form and is part of the program. The ingredients have been proven in double-blind clinical trials to eliminate parasites.

So will wormwood. Just brew up a batch of absinthe and liberally apply Dave's Insanity Sauce to your food for a few days and *NOTHING* will be alive in there.