Terrorist cell taking a dry run????

[hippietim]

Shredmonster - I'm sorry you don't get it. It's not about political correctness. It is racism. You deny that but in fact it is by definition racism when you single out a group of folks based on their race for any reason. Just because you are ok with it doesn't make it right for the rest of us. You go on and live happily pretending that there is no harm in racism if it's for the right reason. History is filled with examples of the horrors that become of "intolerance for the right reason" whether it's race, religion, color, whatever. It never ends well. Ever.

None of you has said where you would draw the line. Where is the line? Blacks? Mexicans? Jews? Arabs? Pakistanis? People that look like Arabs (again, remember all the NON-MUSLIM NON-ARABS that were attacked and some killed after 9/11)?

I know, how about we single out Italians? After all, we know some of them are connected to organized crime. Right?

How about the Irish? Everyone knows some of them have ties to the IRA.

At what point do you actually try to solve the problem without killing people or stripping people of their rights?

[hippietim]

BTW, those of you that are willing to give up rights so easily are just showing how scared you are. The terrorists have beat you already.

[Ralph E.]

Hippietim,

Who's covering the racism that i'm receiving as a white male with regards to employment?

NO ONE. Because it's not a juicy story. It doesn't rile up the public, and it doesn't get anyone elected.

17 years experience and an MBA and where is my job? Overseas in Pakistan and India (among others).

What is MY government (supposedly) doing for me, to protect me and my wife. Absolutely nothing and in fact, their policies and actions actually hurt us.

I have an idea, let's make the national language spanish (or ebonics, arabic, or whatever you want) and keep raising health care and gas prices astronomically (the only two industries the politicians seem to care about) and get the destruction of this country over with once and for all.

No need for a slow death.

[hippietim]

The flip side of the coin is, if you and I and Tim are going to be pulled over for long hair, which is still happening despite the Constitution, why not profile people of the group that HAS attacked us, when they are doing something suspicious?

I'm with you there. Let's go round up all the short-haired men that attack my sense of well being and interrogate them. I hate those foliclly challenged bastards.

These guys had no business boarding a school bus, nearly 5 years after 9/11 they should well know not to do such suspicious acts whether they've been here or back in Saudi. They lied about their point of origin.

Yep - that was pretty stupid. To the parents, the bigger question is what the fuck is going on that two grown men can board a school bus? How fucking stupid was that bus driver?

And I get pulled over to the special rooms everytime I fly anywhere, even though I'm not of the ethnic background to be made as al-Qaeda. I just deal with it, it's life in the new era.

That happened to me even before 9/11 all the time. One particular time was pretty funny, I was searched entering Germany because they thought I was a drug dealer based solely on my appearance (I speak German, they didn't realize that as they were talking trash about me). My girlfriend and I got a big kick out them searching our yogurt covered peanuts.

[hippietim]

Hippietim,

Who's covering the racism that i'm receiving as a white male with regards to employment?

NO ONE. Because it's not a juicy story. It doesn't rile up the public, and it doesn't get anyone elected.

17 years experience and an MBA and where is my job? Overseas in Pakistan and India (among others).

What is MY government (supposedly) doing for me, to protect me and my wife. Absolutely nothing and in fact, their policies and actions actually hurt us.

I have an idea, let's make the national language spanish (or ebonics, arabic, or whatever you want) and keep raising health care and gas prices astronomically (the only two industries the politicians seem to care about) and get the destruction of this country over with once and for all.

No need for a slow death.

Ralph - I am 100% with you there. I fucking hate this. My profession is being farmed overseas too. But that is not about racism. If you were willing to work for pennies on the dollar you'd have no problem finding work. This has been going on since the 50's and 60's that I am aware of - it all started with migrant workers doing the "jobs no American wants". Imagine everyone's surprise when it turns out they are willing to do work that Americans DO want to do for a lot less money. Illegal workers are a bigger insult in my mind - it is out-sourcing within our own country and it is illegal. It's tragically comical to think back to Reagan, Bush Sr., and Clinton telling us to get reeducated because just the crappy jobs are going overseas and Americans will be more prosperous because of it.

At this point you better have a degree in being an out-sourcing executive to make a living.

[~K~]

Yep - that was pretty stupid. To the parents, the bigger question is what the fuck is going on that two grown men can board a school bus? How fucking stupid was that bus driver?

BINGO we have a winner.. this was exactly what I've been waiting to hear.. not because they were arab ...simply because they were grown men where they should not have been ..

[atomic charvel guy]

California is the place you wanna be.

[St.James]

Hippietim,

Who's covering the racism that i'm receiving as a white male with regards to employment?

NO ONE. Because it's not a juicy story. It doesn't rile up the public, and it doesn't get anyone elected.

17 years experience and an MBA and where is my job? Overseas in Pakistan and India (among others).

What is MY government (supposedly) doing for me, to protect me and my wife. Absolutely nothing and in fact, their policies and actions actually hurt us.

I have an idea, let's make the national language spanish (or ebonics, arabic, or whatever you want) and keep raising health care and gas prices astronomically (the only two industries the politicians seem to care about) and get the destruction of this country over with once and for all.

No need for a slow death.

Exactly!!

[RacerX]

no arabs are getting into my house without a "background" check either. just like i wouldn't let any of you greasy slimeball guitar players in my house either

Oops!

[St.James]

Who dat, yo?

[dd3keegs]

I'm still shocked you bailed on us :ROTF:

My Kids have tubes in thier ears. They tend to get alot of ear infections until they turn 5 years old. Anyway, when it came time for my youngest daughter to speak, she could barely hear and spoke with a speak impediment(Like how some deaf people speak). She was going from one ear infection to another. The Ear/Nose/Throat Doctor said short of moving down south, she couldn't do much about it. So I said screw it, let's move to Florida. The ear infections died down and she speaks near perfectly now. Anyway, I miss New England. Maybe we'll move back when the Kids are older. I'll just have to deal with the sunshine, palm trees, thongs, gators and occasional hurricane (And the random Clueless, Trenchcoat wearing in 85 degree weather, I don't know what a Yellow School Bus is, Towel Head( just kidding Hippietim) Muslims.)

[YetAnotherOne]

As is so often the case this discussion isn't particularly enlightening in the abstract because everyone just lines up given their particular political position. What say we inject some current events into the discussion and see if anyone's point of view is adaptable?

The FBI & DOJ have launched an urgent action against Hezbollah (an Iranian-financed Lebanese terrorist organization for those keeping score at home) members in the United States on the belief that attacks from this group may be imminent.

Now call me crazy but if an Iranian-financed terrorist group based in Lebanon is planning attacks in the US wouldn't be somewhat safer utilizing our limited resources examining more closely the actions of Lebanese and Iranian (or more generally Arab and Persian) folks who're acting suspiciously as opposed to, say, just keeping the normal minimal amount of scrutiny on everyone generally? If not, why not?

I think it takes a fair amount of willful blindness to argue that increased surveillance of those most likely to be affiliated with terrorist groups won't make us safer but I'm open minded and can be convinced otherwise. Fire away.

[RacerX]

i don't trust short-haired people. unless they are heavily tatooed or pierced or otherwise demonic looking.

short-haired people are always trying to opress me. power to the hippies.

Word!

[Tashtego]

Now call me crazy but if an Iranian-financed terrorist group based in Lebanon is planning attacks in the US wouldn't be somewhat safer utilizing our limited resources examining more closely the actions of Lebanese and Iranian (or more generally Arab and Persian) folks who're acting suspiciously as opposed to, say, just keeping the normal minimal amount of scrutiny on everyone generally? If not, why not?

I think it takes a fair amount of willful blindness to argue that increased surveillance of those most likely to be affiliated with terrorist groups won't make us safer but I'm open minded and can be convinced otherwise. Fire away.

I'm sure they will concentrate resources as rationally as they can. The airport security, check-grandma-white-bread stuff is a smoke and mirrors joke. If that was really our security we would already have suffered many more attacks. I think governments around the world must be aggressively going out and snatching or killing likely enemies before they get here but who knows? Every Moslem I know was interviewed by a couple FBI agents after 9/11. It is nice to sit back and talk about how blind we are to differences between people and cultures and that we never discriminate but our very existence requires someone else to do the dirty work for us while we sit back and congratulate ourselves on our magnanimity.
Besides that, I don't even concede that focusing on Moslems or people who look like they are from Moslem parts of the world for questioning is even an example of racism. It is simply a rational response to the situation we as a society find ourselves in. There is no loss of freedom at stake for the loyal American Moslems. There were no wide-spread assaults on Moslems here in the US after 9/11. There were hardly any at all. There probably isn’t another country and people in the world that would respond to the provocations we have suffered as generously as we have.

[Misanthrope189]

I have a question for all of you. When we outsource jobs, don't the foreign countries that work our jobs for a lot less money, do so only because their economy can function within that salary? I mean, obviously here with gas going up above 3 dollars a gallon, and college costs in general being astronomical, there's no way Americans could accept lower wages, our economy just isn't designed for it. We'd crash. I feel cheated, because as far as I know, there is no way we can counter outsourcing, because as long as foreign countries' economies are at a level where those people can work for a much lower wage, we here in America are screwed. The media seems to portray outsourcing as though these foreign countries and workers are so graciously accepting lower wages for our jobs, like they're saints or something. But I feel like it's an economical thing. Does anyone have any info on whether this is true or not?

Cheers,
Nick