So a buddy of mine got a gun permit....

[OnlineStageGear]

That is why I'm aginst handguns and the right to carry...sorry folks.

I guess I'm just old school....I rather kick the fukk outta someone than kill them. I guess people today dont learn to street fight or protect themselves...g-loc and load is for lazy whimps

All it takes is for spur of a moment reaction while impaired and you kill someone. I know I dont have all the details on what lead to the shooting so just speaking in general terms..

This is true, and I would be more than happy to give up my guns once they announce there are no illegal ones out there. What my buddy did here makes up 1/10 of 1% of all gun crimes. The rest are commited with illegal guns.

They have updated the story since I posted it. When I posted it they didn't even have either name released. Another web site has the story as his sister was fighting with the same guy earlier and user pepper spray on him. http://www.wtvh.com/Story.aspx?type=ln&NStoryID=2497 It also list him as being charged with first degree assault.

first degree assault - requires for its commission the infliction of serious physical injury coupled with some aggravating factor or particularly malicious intent. Presently, this crime is only a Class C felony; the maximum sentence is 15 years and the minimum sentence may be as low as 18 months

[St.James]

I have a permit and carry with me everywhere I go, except bars and other illegal places. I take guns very seriously and while I believe deeply in the right to bear arms I don't think everyone should have one, but I also don't believe any American should be foolish enough to second guess or disagree with our bill of rights and constitution. That is what separates this country from every other nation on the planet.

Sorry Shawn, not being ass here, but knowing how to fight won't keep you from being killed by some asshole with an illegal gun. I was in the martial arts for the biggest part of my life. While I'm quite certain I can protect myself hand to hand I've been around long enough and have seen plenty to know that even the baddest of the badasses don't stand a chance against a gang ambush and in my city it's very likely to happen and has right around the corner from me!

About 6 or 7 weeks ago an employee at a grocery store here went ape shit and started stabbing other employees with a butchers knife. Who stopped him, the old security guard, some badass who knows how to street fight? Nope, it was a legally armed citizen!

I don't carry because I want to stop crime or because I want to be a cowboy, I don't want to be a statistic or have someone say something stupid like "he was in the wrong place ant the wrong time". I prefer to hear something like, "the criminal tried to rob or kill the wrong guy".

I realize some people hate guns and I respect that more than they respect my right to own and carry, BUT what these people better understand it is that right that helped make this country what it is... Not a bunch of street fighters.

I think we all know how much protection we can expect from our government should something happen on our own soil. Tax paying citizens will be left to care and provide for and pretect themselves. Do you really want to rely on your street fighting skills against an aggressive armed enemy?

[RacerX]

+1 St James!

[GodOfRhythm]

I have extensive psychological probs that are documented due to my work injury. I won't even attempt to go for a permit, even tho I been told by my shefiffs office they'd push me right thru..being a retired CPD in good standing.

I won't carry my off duty S&W airweight unless I'm in Cleveland..I'm safe carrying it in the city. But I never go out ..so.

I KNOW if I popped someone they are going to pull my medical files and call me on the carpet..that's for certain..

A good reason why I don't go to bars...I love my my wife, kid, home, all my toys and money.. for me it's not worth the risk...

I do know how to CYA..I do that well..so that's a good thing..

I can't say I know how you feel, that wouldn't be honest or fair to you. But seriously man, that is some seriously harsh shit you went through. I probably would've just lost it in that situation and crapped my pants.

But big respect to you, Bill.

It's just so shitty, you put everything on the line for society and in return society basically fucks you over. The world sucks in that way.

[5074charvel]

That trial was one of the worst experiences of my life. The family would say the most evil things to me outside the courtroom..like I killed their loved one personally. And, I only second chaired the trial. I knew that was it for me and serious criminal defense.

Mike

I know what you´re talking about. Years ago I assisted the defense lawyer in a murder case. We were not insulted but seeing the victims´widow and his two young children every day in the courtroom wasn´t nice either. Not that I couldn´t do my job but I didn´t want to be confronted with these "situations" furthermore.

[Shawn Lutz]

I respect your viewpoint and fully understand that. I don't want to turn this thread into a gun debate (I have one). I think its more of a change in the times if yuo will.....I'm 42 and where I come from if you hand an issue with someone you just fought it out until someone gave up and left You didn't need a gun for protection back then.

I do admit I like hearing those stories where innocent civilians fight fire with fire and win against the ass scum criminals I'm in Texas and we have the right to carry and the right to protect personal property. One could snipe someone attempting steal their car from their driveway...

I'n not against guns per se, just not 100% for hand guns. My friends have them, family have them and hell even I would have one if I were to spend a lot of time in higher crime areas. I do think it should be pretty hard to obtain a right to carry permit imho. Certain individuals do NOT need to be carrying or are carrying for all the wrong reasons.

I also agree with you that folks need to be ready to protect themselves in the future. Its obvious the government would not beable to maintain order if a sitiuation were to arrise...see Katrina as an example of how quickly the shit hits the fan

I have a permit and carry with me everywhere I go, except bars and other illegal places. I take guns very seriously and while I believe deeply in the right to bear arms I don't think everyone should have one, but I also don't believe any American should be foolish enough to second guess or disagree with our bill of rights and constitution. That is what separates this country from every other nation on the planet.

Sorry Shawn, not being ass here, but knowing how to fight won't keep you from being killed by some asshole with an illegal gun. I was in the martial arts for the biggest part of my life. While I'm quite certain I can protect myself hand to hand I've been around long enough and have seen plenty to know that even the baddest of the badasses don't stand a chance against a gang ambush and in my city it's very likely to happen and has right around the corner from me!

About 6 or 7 weeks ago an employee at a grocery store here went ape shit and started stabbing other employees with a butchers knife. Who stopped him, the old security guard, some badass who knows how to street fight? Nope, it was a legally armed citizen!

I don't carry because I want to stop crime or because I want to be a cowboy, I don't want to be a statistic or have someone say something stupid like "he was in the wrong place ant the wrong time". I prefer to hear something like, "the criminal tried to rob or kill the wrong guy".

I realize some people hate guns and I respect that more than they respect my right to own and carry, BUT what these people better understand it is that right that helped make this country what it is... Not a bunch of street fighters.

I think we all know how much protection we can expect from our government should something happen on our own soil. Tax paying citizens will be left to care and provide for and pretect themselves. Do you really want to rely on your street fighting skills against an aggressive armed enemy?

[St.James]

I do think it should be pretty hard to obtain a right to carry permit imho. Certain individuals do NOT need to be carrying or are carrying for all the wrong reasons.

I'm not 100% sure about the entire country, but a permit class is a requirement here to get a permit. When I took my class there was people in there with guns who couldn't hit the target 7 feet in front of them. That's bad on so many levels.

I think it should be like this, and keep in mind I'm very pro gun... One should have to take a class, not only only to get the permit, but to learn the laws, safety and how to actually shoot the gun before they are allowed to even buy one.

The way it is now a background check is run and people are on their way out the door with a weapon they don't know how to use. Again, that's bad on so many levels, even if their intentions are to keep it in their house only. A weapon you don't know how to use is not only an ineffective weapon, but can be used against you!

When you go buy a car they won't sell you one without a license to drive it, same should go with guns. Like I said before, I take guns and our 2nd ammendment very seriously, but not everyone should have one.

So we're probably on the same page with this issue or pretty close to it.

[horns666]

Good points, I'm 42 too..like Shawn

they should really screen when issuing permits, with a fine tooth comb..I think they do here in Ohio, My Dad applied for a permit but was rejected for a felony on his record in 1967..the only thing on his record..and I had that record expunged..doesn't matter..that only works for employment puposes and silimilar thing s really , he appealed and was rejected again..so there ya go..

See ya guys, GOR, much respect in return bro..

Peace, I'll be busy today..

Bill

[mm2002]

So, Mr. Massett had been attacked a year and a half ago? He's got anger built up already, so it may have not taken much to make him snap. His best hope now is that the guy he shot doesn't die. I wonder how far that guy pushed him though?

[OnlineStageGear]

So, Mr. Massett had been attacked a year and a half ago? He's got anger built up already, so it may have not taken much to make him snap. His best hope now is that the guy he shot doesn't die. I wonder how far that guy pushed him though?

We were wondering if that was the same guy, but it looks like it wasn't.

[bratfink]

Americans.

The thing that really worries me is that kids in this country are mimicking gun culture because they see all the rubbish that is sprouted from your music industry.

When are you going to learn that carrying a gun is not a basic human right. Unless you are a Soldier or Cop (although our cops don't have firearms) with orders to carry a weapon, or a farmer/gamekeeper what possible reason could you have for carrying a firearm?

I understand the whole self defence theory but if no-one is allowed to carry a gun then the risk is much reduced (but not eliminated, there will always be wankers).

In any case from what we have seen of US 'fire first, ask later' attitudes (bear in mind that during the first Gulf War the British Army lost more soliders to US fire than they did to Iraqi!!!) I can't be certain that most Americans are responsible enough to carry guns. The solution, take them all away.

[El_Kabong]

Cowboys should have died out with John Wayne. Fuck guns.

[neilli]

When are you going to learn that carrying a gun is not a basic human right. Unless you are a Soldier or Cop (although our cops don't have firearms) with orders to carry a weapon, or a farmer/gamekeeper what possible reason could you have for carrying a firearm?

I understand the whole self defence theory but if no-one is allowed to carry a gun then the risk is much reduced (but not eliminated, there will always be wankers).

In any case from what we have seen of US 'fire first, ask later' attitudes (bear in mind that during the first Gulf War the British Army lost more soliders to US fire than they did to Iraqi!!!) I can't be certain that most Americans are responsible enough to carry guns. The solution, take them all away.

Um, some good points there and gun culture scares the shit outta me too, but that's a great way to tar a whole nation with one brush.

I'd duck and cover if I were you mate.....

[StukaJU87]

Americans.

The thing that really worries me is that kids in this country are mimicking gun culture because they see all the rubbish that is sprouted from your music industry.

When are you going to learn that carrying a gun is not a basic human right. Unless you are a Soldier or Cop (although our cops don't have firearms) with orders to carry a weapon, or a farmer/gamekeeper what possible reason could you have for carrying a firearm?

I understand the whole self defence theory but if no-one is allowed to carry a gun then the risk is much reduced (but not eliminated, there will always be wankers).

In any case from what we have seen of US 'fire first, ask later' attitudes (bear in mind that during the first Gulf War the British Army lost more soliders to US fire than they did to Iraqi!!!) I can't be certain that most Americans are responsible enough to carry guns. The solution, take them all away.

The whole tone of this post enfuriated me. So I'll sum up my response in 2 words...Fuck Off.

[MBreinin]

Americans.

The thing that really worries me is that kids in this country are mimicking gun culture because they see all the rubbish that is sprouted from your music industry.

When are you going to learn that carrying a gun is not a basic human right. Unless you are a Soldier or Cop (although our cops don't have firearms) with orders to carry a weapon, or a farmer/gamekeeper what possible reason could you have for carrying a firearm?

I understand the whole self defence theory but if no-one is allowed to carry a gun then the risk is much reduced (but not eliminated, there will always be wankers).


In any case from what we have seen of US 'fire first, ask later' attitudes (bear in mind that during the first Gulf War the British Army lost more soliders to US fire than they did to Iraqi!!!) I can't be certain that most Americans are responsible enough to carry guns. The solution, take them all away.

Limeys.

Look, if you outlaw firearms, the only people who will have them will be outlaws. You will not be able to take firearms away from people in the U.S. That would, literally, be a call to revolution here.

Unless you live here, which you don't, you really don't know shit about how it works in America. While carrying a firearm may not be a basic human right, our Constitution has granted us that "right".

Of course, we always shoot first and ask questions later..yep, always...that just defines Americans. I am simply stunned by the depth of your knowledge of all things American!!

Mike