I am in disbelief of this..

[Bert]

I think it is great that you didn't run into any Stalinists at the university you attended. However, the argument that because you did not they must not exist and that I must be an 'extreme right-winger' inventing them is very weak to say the least.

I wasn't pointing the finger specifically at you. Go back and read the thread if you didn't notice several extreme right-wing statements with absolutely no factual or experiential basis. I never claimed that Stalinists don't exist (I'm sure they do). I'm just providing a counterexample to your implication that Stalinists must run rampant in east-coast academia because you heard about it from a few friends.

I also mean that the general regard and esteem associated with a humanities major has declined. There are a number of factors involved but I think that the general public perception of a typical liberal arts education is that the education is deeply compromised by the lack of intellectual diversity and rigor.

Keep repeating that enough and someone might actually believe you. What makes you such an expert on the public perception of the liberal arts? Once again my experience is strongly at odds with your claims. And no, I'm not a liberal arts major.

Yes there are many other degrees held in higher esteem. If there has been a decline in the esteem of the liberal arts (something I've not witnessed), blaming it on "lack of intellectual diversity" is just silly.

[horns666]

Good advice.

Just remember, they're banning Harry Potter because it teaches Satanism. If you see me taken away, it's because: "Professor converts students to Wicca."

By the way, when I dropped my corporate job coming out of college, I somehow landed in law enforcement in New Haven, Ct. I worked the jails as a deputy sheriff. Did that for two years before moving to academia.

Well then, you certainly had a taste of my perspective.

I was called into the Police Cheif's office for reading The Satanic Bible on my lunch break , this was about 10 years ago..I just said I said.."Well Sir, no disrespect ..but I see many cops reading "bibles" on their lunch break, why aren't they in question..umm other than that, did I do something wrong here"..I was excused and went back to reading my book. A year later I received the heads up that badge# 666 was retiring and I typed for it..The Chief's response was "Bill, only a sick SOB would request this"..

I would've got it but I was seriously injured shortly after and retired. If I was still working my badge would be #666.

Well guys, I'm certainly not here to "win" anything..you guys have fun..I'm out.

Bill Z

[hippietim]

I am not objecting to a professor bringing up topics that can be contended. That is what makes an education. I object to any teacher that comes off with a "view" that bleeds into the flow of what should be clean of bias.

have you ever found anyone that has a strong opinion on a meaningful topic that could discuss it "clean of bias"? i know i've never met such a person - none of them are posting in this thread.

[hippietim]

So you're teaching a kids' book in college? Why is that?

i must have missed that - where'd he say that?

[hippietim]

This "Joanne Chesimard/Assata Shakur" is clearly a piece of shit and should not be celebrated in any manner other than for her appearance on the "The Running Man" during her entertaining slaughter.

But I think you guys are making a lot of big and oddly focused leaps concluding that this is somehow an academia thing. Everywhere I go I run into crazy asshole wanting to celebrate other crazy assholes or crazy assholes that want to villify perfectly reasonable people/things. And this is in all walks of life - left wing, right wing, chicken wing, religious, aetheist, cop, teacher, doctor, out-sourcing consultant, engineer, etc.

People should speak out against what they see is wrong with this country. I can't recall a time during my life where there wasn't something worth speaking out against.

There is nothing wrong with being radical in your views - in fact, a large number of you folks are pretty fucking radical as nears as I can tell. Hell, growing up in the south with long hair listening to heavy metal was considered radical by plenty of folks.

[horns666]

have you ever found anyone that has a strong opinion on a meaningful topic that could discuss it "clean of bias"? i know i've never met such a person - none of them are posting in this thread.

Yes Tim, I am pure as a 45 year old blushing bride in white.

[danastas]

I didn't but I was joking on Potter, so I could see how it was confusing.

[horns666]

Harry Twatter..I did watch that movie!!

[Bert]

This "Joanne Chesimard/Assata Shakur" is clearly a piece of shit and should not be celebrated in any manner other than for her appearance on the "The Running Man" during her entertaining slaughter.

+1

There is nothing wrong with being radical in your views - in fact, a large number of you folks are pretty fucking radical as nears as I can tell.

:ROTF:

And it wouldn't be nearly as entertaining around here if it were otherwise!

[Twisteramps]

Come to America. You ever hear of stem-cell research?

Here's another place to go for stem cell research.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6171083.stm

Pete

[lerxstcat]

Good advice.

Just remember, they're banning Harry Potter because it teaches Satanism. If you see me taken away, it's because: "Professor converts students to Wicca."

Tim, this is the quote I asked Danastas about. I guess he meant another book that he was "converting students to Wicca" from that he sees himself "taken away" for.

[horns666]

They pulled Mark Twain books for not being PC today..so why is this any different.

The more things change the more stay the same.

[Tashtego]

I don't have time right now to get into it cause I have to run along and teach, but show me your idea of a Right-wing course in English.

Left-wing I guess means what? Why is it left-wing?

Explain.

I hate discussing or arguing in generalities.

Give me some meat to consider.

By the way, I didn't call you a liar. I said I don't believe you. There's a difference.

I never advocated 'right' or 'left' wing courses. Just a diversity of topics treated in the courses by a politically diverse faculty. I'll take a shot at it anyway.

A conservative introductory english lit. course would include an exposure to cultural marxist theory, Frankfurt School theory, deconstructionism. The course would critically examine the goals of the originators of these theories and trace the effect it has had on literary criticism and society at large over the last 70 years.


A leftist course example can be easily found by picking up the syllabus of any English lit. course at any university in the US.

Left-wing as used in this thread's context refers to that cultural marxist ideology that unites the marxist/feminist/racial/gender politics of the 'progressives.' The 'Frankfurt School' of Marcuse et al. who advocate undermining the otherwise stubornly resistant western Christian societies by forming a proletariat of the 'disenfranchied' women, minorities, homosexuals, and exploiting these natural cultural faultlines to hasten the collapse of the capitalist hegemony and pave the way for the formation of the 'workers paradise'. The unwashed of course being led by our Platonic philospher kings from the Ivory Towers.

BTW, I'm not calling you a liar either but I don't believe you are really a professor of english and don't already know all this.

[lerxstcat]

That's really sad! Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn, two classic books that I loved as a kid, really should be part of the American experience for a kid growing up. Sure it might be far from the experience of a kid in the hood, but it was far from OUR experiences growing up across this country in cities, country or small towns. That was kind of the point.

[danastas]

I never advocated 'right' or 'left' wing courses. Just a diversity of topics treated in the courses by a politically diverse faculty. I'll take a shot at it anyway.

A conservative introductory english lit. course would include an exposure to cultural marxist theory, Frankfurt School theory, deconstructionism. The course would critically examine the goals of the originators of these theories and trace the effect it has had on literary criticism and society at large over the last 70 years.

I assume you're talking about a grad intro class. Obviously there's not enough time in one class to take this all on. In fact, there are very few people who even have a deep background in all 3. You have specialists, etc. But regardless, give me the political angle. What is it?

Left-wing as used in this thread's context refers to that cultural marxist ideology that unites the marxist/feminist/racial/gender politics of the 'progressives.' The 'Frankfurt School' of Marcuse et al. who advocate undermining the otherwise stubornly resistant western Christian societies by forming a proletariat of the 'disenfranchied' women, minorities, homosexuals, and exploiting these natural cultural faultlines to hasten the collapse of the capitalist hegemony and pave the way for the formation of the 'workers paradise'. The unwashed of course being led by our Platonic philospher kings from the Ivory Towers.

BTW, I'm not calling you a liar either but I don't believe you are really a professor of english and don't already know all this.

So, you think this is taught in school, eh? I've taught at 4 schools, next year I have a post at a new place and I've looked at their curriculum. This description is probably 30 years behind the times. In a lit survey course, you'll run into a variety of literary theories as part of the history of criticism. You'll run into theories of philology, new criticism, marxist litcrit, psychoanalytical, etc. I guess some of these can be labeled liberal or conservative, but I wouldn't do it. Is that what you're talking about? Toss in some philology alongside deconstruction? That balances it?

Still, I'd like to see a specific course, not just one that critiques what's out there. What do conservatives have to teach us about literature? The conservative course you're citing above sounds like a critique of what might be labeled leftist literary theory (even though something like deconstruction includes a critique of marxism). Given the fact that this critique of past literary theories is quite common in universities already, I'm not sure how/why such a course would be labeled conservative. Put it this way, can someone with leftist leanings teach that course? Why/why not?