Synth Guitar?

[Mario8672]

What's a synth guitar?
thanks

[charvelguy]

Well samples took care of the true synth aspect of many of todays 'synth' sounds that they can be achieved with traditional outboard gear like an amp or an effect. You don't need a synth guitar with a specialized pickup and interface controller anymore. You don't need a module or a keyboard so much anymore to emulate a sound created by another instrument.

The line 6 stuff has synth patches. Roland was an innovator and made the guitar synth affordable with the VG-8 and VG-88. Back in the 80's tho.. even that was really expensive.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synth_guitar

[roodyrocker]

Not entirely true about not needing Synth guitars anymore. While Line 6 and others have some fancy effects they still don't approach the Roland GR-33 or GR-20 sounds. I have a GR-33 that I use for a couple songs my band does and I don't know a ton about the unit yet but I can do one or two intruments at the same time with it, I can blend my guitar sound and synth sounds. I have a GK-3 pickup mounted to my Les Paul Studio for this but I wouldn't mind having a factory built Roland ready guitar with built in pickup as opposed to added on like my Les Paul. The GR-33 is no longer sold in the USA new but you can get the GR-20 for about $600-700 new including the GK divided pickup. The GR-33 was about that plus you had to add the pickup. However, I don't think the GR-20 will layer sounds like the GR-33 does. I use mine to do cover songs in my band such as the violin part to Whitesnake's Still Of The Night and Journey's Seperate Ways. If I kew how to get the right sounds we'd do Judas Priest's Turbo Lover but I'm not that good at programming a GR-33 Originally they used the old GR-707 (remember the guitar with the big stabilizer bar spanning from the top of the body to the headstock?).
There is also another company whose name escapes me, Axiom perhaps, that makes a rack mounted module that is even more incredible. Saw and heard it at NAMM in January.
Anyway, its strange playing one of these guitar synths at first. You have to change the way you play the guitar at times. For example you can't slide up or down a string while doing a piano sound because there is no continous way to do it on a real piano. Sometimes bending strings is weird. Picking has to be more precise so you don't trigger false notes. Its hard work!
For more complicated stuff we use a mini-disc player live to do keys. There is no way in hell I'm playing Petrucci on guitar while at the same time covering Kevin Moore and Jordan Rudess on keys when we do Dream Theater's Pull Me Under

Rudy

https://www.wickedrocks.com

[hippietim]

Rudy - you mean Axon. I have one. It's pretty cool but the Roland stuff is way easier to use.

There is also a place in between Line 6 style guitar/amp modeling and full MIDI guitar synth triggering. That happy place is called the VG-8/88 (and soon the VG-99!!!). It uses a GK compatible divided pickup but it does not do the slow and error prone translation into MIDI notes. Rather it uses it as a fundamental audio source to model from. The VG stuff can model a Stratocaster through a Fender Twin but it can also do psychedelic transforms making your guitar sound very synthy. You can transpose strings, diatonic harmonies, 12-strings, move pickups, make your own modeled "guitar", etc. Basically the VG does what a Variax and a POD (and the VG-8 has been around for like 15 years). There is no delay/lag with the VG like there is with MIDI guitar triggering.

BTW, the VG-99 does all of that plus:

• two complete guitar/amp model paths
• the amp modeling and effects are GT-Pro level and then some
• it has 3 independent pitch transposers so you can do stuff like a drop tuned 12-string with a drop tuned Telecaster
• it does the old GR guitar synth stuff from before MIDI
• it also has MIDI guitar support so you can trigger a MIDI synth

As you might imagine, I've already called Matt to preorder my VG-99.

Rudy, if you play Turbo Lover I will have to shun you at the next NAMM show.

[Guitardude86]

Better run for cover...

[roodyrocker]

Axon! thats it, thanks Tim. I spent some time at NAMM checking it out. Yeah it does look pretty involved but quality wise it sounded great! I saw the VG-99 as well and thats pretty wild. In fact there was a demo clip from NAMM that was up on a website a couple months back, Musician's Friend maybe??? I can't remember. I might have to look into one of those down the road. They also demo'd the VG Strat thing which has a few VG sounds on board the guitar from the factory but nothing like the full blown VG-99.
Our singer has been hounding me to do Turbo Lover but I have no clue where to begin with those synth sounds so it most likely won't happen, no need to worry Like I said though, we do Dream Theater and Rush live so wouldn't that make up for it

Rudy

https://www.wickedrocks.com

[hippietim]

Actually, the Axon onboard Synth is pretty weak. Pretty much any of the Rolands sound better. The Axon is the better pitch-to-MIDI convertor which is why everyone goes ga-ga over it.

I use a Roland XV-5050 for my synth sounds.

[CharvelRocker]

Roland has also made a synth guitar in the past, the G-707. The Midi unit is built into the guitar. I've been gassing for one for awhile. Amir Derakh used one a lot in Orgy. Ibanez also made one (actually I believe they made the G-707 for Roland as well). What do the new VG-99s run price wise anyway?

[charvelguy]

I still have my 707 setup. As well as the XING 2010 and VG8 with the Roland Ready strat. I'm just getting all this stuff setup where I can explore their capabilities further.

I tried it for awhile, stuck it away, time to take it out of mothbals.

[hippietim]

The VG-99 is supposed to street for about $1100-1200 I believe. But I would contact Matt for a great price on the VG-99.

That may sound like a lot but you are getting the capabilities of a GR-300 (old school synth), two VG-8/88s, two GT-Pros, a GI-20 (MIDI convertor), and then some.

[charvelguy]

Thats a pretty fair price for all that capability. I just spent 64.00 on a M-512G backup memory card too. I wonder if they kept a card slot using the old cards for sound transfers? I'll have to look into it.

[hippietim]

I *seriously* doubt the M card will work in the 99 considering it won't work in the 88.

BTW, did you upgrade your VG-8 to the EX?

[charvelguy]

Good thing I didn't buy the VG-88 thinking I could transfer. I heard it had alot of bugs but they did have a new boxed one last year at GC for 350.00.. which I thought was a great price. I think I'd rather have a GNX4 tho.

I know I have the S1 expansion kit. I borrowed a upgrade card with a bunch of 'guitar hero' sounds on it from a JCF'r a couple years ago.
It had VH, Lukather. Were at D bank at the very least. Not sure if I expanded it to E though. I'll have to drag it out and plug it in. I gotta change the batteries on most of my stuff anyway.

[hippietim]

I've owned a couple 88's and never hung onto them. They don't have all the cool synthy/trippy stuff. It is not a straight upgrade at all - some things are better, others are not. I love the VG-8 though.

[Endrik]

I'm concidering getting some badass software on my mac and use it as a synth processor.

John McLaughlin runs one of his lines through a mac wich is loaded with top notch orchestration/synth/etc. software and all that runs in Logic enviorment.
Sounds fucking amazing.

Doug Wimbish does the same thing with his bass rig.

The sounds I've heard done with Mac's on soft sound more impressive than the ones with midi-synth devices in my opinion.... yes even better than Robert Fripp's sounds.