What happened to "Labor Law"?

[MBreinin]

That's why I belong to a union. I don't have to take any kind of BS from anyone unless it's specified in the contract. 15 min. break at 9:30, 30 min. lunch at 12:00, and 15 min. break at 3:00, anything over 8 is time + 1/2, anything over 10 is double, Sat is time + 1/2 and Sun and holidays are double. Collective bargaining does have its drawbacks just like everything else, but it has provided me with a living wage.

And that is why American industry is at an absolute low point. Unions. Entitlement mentality. Wages and benefits too high, productivity too low. We simply cannot compete with countries that run their work force into the ground because of our Union structure. It just costs too much money to manufacture goods in the United States. Whole industries have vanished from our country. While Unionization certainly was a worthy cause in its infancy, I do not think it was ever envisioned that it would ruin American industry.

Mike

[SeventhSon]

And that is why American industry is at an absolute low point. Unions. Entitlement mentality. Wages and benefits too high, productivity too low. We simply cannot compete with countries that run their work force into the ground because of our Union structure. It just costs too much money to manufacture goods in the United States. Whole industries have vanished from our country. While Unionization certainly was a worthy cause in its infancy, I do not think it was ever envisioned that it would ruin American industry.

Mike

I understand your point, but it's deeper than that. US corporations will outsource their manufacturing to China to take advantage of

• slave labor (practically)
• no OSHA
• 0 environmental laws
• 0 regulatory oversight (poisoned toothpaste, toys with lead paint, etc)

So even without unions, US corporations will outsource to countries where the cost of manufacturing is ZERO compared to the cost of reasonable consumer/labor/environmental safeguards that we have in America. The solution (imho) is to only allow imports from countries that protect basic labor/environmental/consumer safeguards as us. Then our manufacturing will be able to compete on a more level playing field.

Basically, US corporations are greedy entities that could give a fuck about the US.

[fett]

Econ 101. Make the same thing at the lowest possible cost. When the US was "local", that meant paying as low a wage as possible. When our unions took hold, workers had a chance to buy the stuff they were making. That made the middle-class. Then Japan started making stuff cheaper. Jobs lost. Then, the rest of Asia could do it even cheaper. Jobs lost. Now, we have "Globalization". And now we, in the US, can't manufacture anything cheaper than the rest of the world. There are exceptions. Boeing. But they import a tons of parts. And they are one of two. I just wonder how much longer we can lose jobs; not pay our workers enough; ship any work including IT and X-Ray diagnoses overseas and still support the "American Dream".

[Spivonious]

The only thing that will save U.S. workers is getting rid of unions. You like your breaks. As you described them that matches PA labor laws. The overtime doesn't quite match (it's time + 1/2 for anything over 40/week) but it's close enough.

Unions are definitely the reason tuitions go up at the state schools. The teachers threaten to strike every year the state says they need to cut back on the budget. For some reason the faculty thinks they're entitled to 4%/year raises and free healthcare.

[fett]

Wait a second.:ROTF: This was about breaks and no "Stool for you". Oh,oh. I did it again.

[Thrust]

The only thing that will save U.S. workers is getting rid of unions. You like your breaks. As you described them that matches PA labor laws. The overtime doesn't quite match (it's time + 1/2 for anything over 40/week) but it's close enough.

Unions are definitely the reason tuitions go up at the state schools. The teachers threaten to strike every year the state says they need to cut back on the budget. For some reason the faculty thinks they're entitled to 4%/year raises and free healthcare.

Apparently PA doesn't have a law that guarantee's a lunch break.

Also, while full of problems, unions are the best solution we currently have to maintaining a middle-class. Lots of literature on the benefits of unions.

Many employers and employees want to know if breaks and meals are required by law. You might be surprised to learn that Pennsylvania does not have any laws on the books specifically related to this area, except those pertaining to minors. Pennsylvania law requires that minors ages 14 to 17 must be given a meal or rest period of at least 30 minutes if they have worked five hours or more continuously.

taken from http://blog.laborlawcenter.com/2006/...and-break-law/

[Scooter]

http://www.ironworkers.org/ht/d/OrganizationDetails/i/2/aboutus/pid/224

I don't go to the office, I build it.

[Spivonious]

Apparently PA doesn't have a law that guarantee's a lunch break.

Also, while full of problems, unions are the best solution we currently have to maintaining a middle-class. Lots of literature on the benefits of unions.




taken from http://blog.laborlawcenter.com/2006/...and-break-law/

That's interesting to know. Every job I've ever had, from Burger King up to the programming job I have now has always had at least 30 minutes for lunch as long as you worked >5 hour shift. Maybe it's just easier to treat everyone the same rather than singling out the minors.

[Model1VH2]

This reminds me of that Sienfeld episode where George buys the security guard a rocking chair.

[lerxstcat]

Apparently PA doesn't have a law that guarantee's a lunch break.

Also, while full of problems, unions are the best solution we currently have to maintaining a middle-class. Lots of literature on the benefits of unions.




taken from http://blog.laborlawcenter.com/2006/...and-break-law/

There may be Federal laws mandating breaks at certain intervals; the Feds require OT pay after 40 hours worked in a week. Of course employers can put you on salary and work you a lot more.

Also, unions are great IF you can maintain your job in the union. I know different industries have different flows, but in plumbing there isn't enough work to keep half the union memvers working.

I worked in a non-union service and repair shop. Primarily residential and light commercial like restaurants and retail stores. These customers will not pay union rates. We avoided union plumbers because they wouldn't do the job required for the pay we could offer. Customers would complain because they'd refuse to clean up after themselves; "That's a helper's job".

Unions are so much about guarding the privileges of the union hierarchy that they make it easy for companies who're outsourcing. Not that those companies wouldn't outsource anyway, to a point; but unions wanting $150 an hour for work that non-union shops dp for $75 an hour is not going to fly in the long run.

If you've been in the un ion long enough to not lose your job, good for you and I don't blame you for feeling as you do. But for people like auto workers, whose jobs are going away forever, or to the South where people hav e been waiting basically 100 years for an economy, well no matter how long you've been in for most of you those jobs are going away.

Our best hope right now is a backlash to the fact that the Chinese have been poisoning us, our pets and our kids with their no-rules manufacturing.

[Jackson/Charvelfan]

Hey fett,
I remember those days working for Shell.
I worked 6.5 hour shift but it was always at least 8.
We had to sign away having a fixed time for breaks and was told you can take one when you are not busy but that almost never happend.
God forbid if the next shift didn't show.

[Soap]

Basically, US corporations are greedy entities that could give a fuck about the US.

Bingo you nailed it. I agree completely.
Heres a link to verify it, well sort of, the obvious is stated wonderfully.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9KReZyAZLI0

[OnlineStageGear]

People start a business to MAKE MONEY. They don't do it to help people get jobs, however if they treat people like crap, you have low productivity and a high turnaround rate and that can hurt the business.

People go to work to MAKE MONEY. You don't go to work to make a business successful. However if you slack off and are not productive it hurts the business and they will can your ass.

[MikeStrat]

And that is why American industry is at an absolute low point. Unions. Entitlement mentality. Wages and benefits too high, productivity too low.

This is so true. As a business owner, I see this mentality every day. Most people come to get jobs not to work, or help themselves or grow the business. They want to know what is the maximum I am going to give them for their minimum amount of effort. This is why I have kept my business too 3-4 emloyees. Nobody wants to work. The attitude around here is people won't get out of bed for less than $50k base and they bring nothing to the table. As far as I'm concerned, they can stay in bed.

[wilkinsi]

The lack of human rights in the workplace you're discussing here is not far off UK standards, in some places at least. Where I work, you work less than a 6 hour shift, you get no break. 7-8 hours = 2x15min, 9 hours= same+1 unpaid lunch. But here comes the best part: If you spend more than 10 mins of going to the toilet, you get bollocked for "not meeting your adherance target". So this weekend, I'm gonna have some really fibre-inducing food, then go to work...