All you interested in WWII .

[shreddermon]

My parents emigrated from Italy in the early 50s. So they were farmers - young kids - over there during the war. My mother tells stories of hiding in the mountain caves from the Germans, how she lost an uncle (who I was named after) when he perished on a sunken Italian Navy ship.

Their generation clearly views the world - and the need for war - differently than most of us born later. And we could learn a lot from their wisdom born through horrific experience.

[fett]

There is this guy about my age that goes to the fleamarket. He collects nothing but WWII stuff. I mean he REALLY COLLECTS . He buys maniquins for the uniforms he has. He's a family man and seems quite normal otherwise. I'm looking forward to hearing what he thinks of the movie. My uncle was a Marine in the Pacific. He was a machine gun sarg. Throughout the '60's and '70's, I tried to get him to tell me about his experiences. He just couldn't do it. I think Burns was right about the window of opportunity to get the story out before there is nobody left to tell it.

[DTP]

Speaking of window of opportunity. The PBS station here is doing a Oral History for WWII. Keyword searchable video clips of the vets telling their stories. These are just vets from AR. My brother is working on this project and they've interviewed hundreds of vets, but are still working on getting them all up on the website.

https://www.intheirwords.org

J.

[Razor]

Thanks for the heads up. I'm watching it tonight.

[lerxstcat]

I've been watching it each night, very sobering to hear the personal stories.

My dad was in the Eighth Army Air Corps stationed in England during the war and was tail gunner and mechanic on a B-17. Hw served in Korea in the USAF as well.

My late brother-in-law served in the Pacific and witnessed Japanese civilians jumping off the cliffs in Saipan as they showed in tonight's show. He always hated the Japanese military for telling the civilians that Americans would eat their babies, and for forcing them off the cliffs at gunpoint.

[fett]

This series is fucking up my sleep pattern. I'm not used to to staying up until 10+PM. I still wake up at 1AM. But, I will not miss this for the world. It is that good. However, I just discovered "Two and a Half Men" on reruns. It's pretty damn funny.

[fett]

"The War" What timing.

This needs a new thread. I am a big WWII history buff. However, Ken Burns has done such a good job on this one, I almost can't watch it. Our troops, in realtime, have gained so much respect from me because WWII has been made personal. I admire our troops as in right now. I just hope the Korean War Vets, Viet Nam Vets, and all this current stuff that our people on the battleline are going through get the same respect. Anti-War PPS liberal BS? Maybe. But, this brings war home for all us. And that is a good thing.

[fett]

I care. Because I sat across the desk from WWII Army Capt. Jim Morris in the late 80's. He would talk to me. He was in Europe and he told me this; " The SS troops would fire all their ammo and then surrender. That worked once and then our troops just shot them dead." He was the most complete nicest person I have met. We are losing a great bunch of people that we can't imagine what they went through.

[Argos]

It was a great series. Personally I think they could have done without a few of the vets they interviewed and their racist overtones, but that was just me. Most of the guys they had on there were very interesting and well spoken.

[VinceV]

I've watched all but the 2nd hour of the last show. I don't recall anyone having racist overtone.

Are you talking about the way that they spoke of the Japanese soldiers?

So many moments stick in my head from that show. The way many of the vets describe things going on around them. From them shooting soldiers swimming out to the open ocean in Saipan, the brutality of the things they did on both sides. To the woman back home talking about how after a while everyone knew someone who wasn't coming home, and when the telegram showed up, they just pulled the shades and that house became lke a ghost home. How after awhile you just didn't ask poeple "How are you?" anymore, because you didn't want to upset people anymore.

Very strong stuff.

[442w30]

Argos,
Forgive me if I am wrong, and I haven't followed the show.....
Aren't you somewhere in Europe (not an American?).

That's not a slam on you, but in order to understand what you are calling racist may not be what we/I consider racist.

If the Americans were stating a dislike/hate for Germans, it was toward the Reich and the baby killer, Europe bombing animals that the gov't wanted them to be and not a hatred for a "German Race". AFAIK a white American can't rtally be racist against a white German since they are of the same "race".

If you are talking about racism toward Japan, then you may have a point, but you have to remember that the Japanese are (were) overall elitist in the Asian world and then "snuk" up on the USA and bombed us cause they thought we were a bunch of wussies that would roll over.
That's the line that the entire generation of Americans that lived through and fought in the war was fed by the American news and propoganda channels.
Now I am not saying that's not what happened. I have heard that we (the gov't) knew ahead of time that we would be bombed, but that entire generaion of Americans lived it.
These Americans were drawn into an enormous conflict by a sneak attack of people that weren't that popular in their own region at the time for these kind of shennanigans. The Japanese inflicted huge losses on Americans, they lierd to their people about what Americans would do to them so they would kill themselves rather than surrender - also cultural pride fed this for them I understand. These men lived conflict with an enemy that didn't speak teir language, blindsided us by sinking a large part of our fleet and killing many men not at war in the process, and was culturally divergent from our own. If you lived to fight in some of these pacific battles, you probably would spew a few "non-PC" statements about the people as a whole you dealt with and who killed your brother soldiers.

Again, I am not trying to defend racism. It's silly. Ferris Buehler said it best and I'll botch a quote - "I don't believe in any ism".
There are a large percentage of people from any race that you should hate, it's not their race that makes them bad people, but that most people just suck.

[Reverend Timmy]

Well said.........

[Argos]

I am an American and also a WWII enthusiast. I had family that fought in both theaters. I'm not saying the comments of these guys should be disregarded--I think they just slightly marred what was otherwise a great film.

I'll try and find which ones in particular I'm talking about (I don't remember exactly what was said or who said it since it's been a few weeks) and if I can I'll post them here. I'd like to hear your take.

At the same time, I do know that Burns' intention was to show the war from a uniquely American viewpoint, so it could be argued that the comments simply added a crude dose of reality.

[Razor]

I think that what really fuels the fires even to this day are the atrocities committed by not only the Nazis, but also the Japanese. The Japanese were as brutal to not only combatants, but also non combatants as were the Germans in their attempt for the "final solution". If the Allied combatants of both theaters of World War II harbor contempt for those they conquered who am I to blame them. They lived and died in a hell the great majority of us will never know. I'm sure that what they saw and/or lived through gave them great reason to "hate" the enemy.

The episode of this series that really gets to me is the one about the young girl and her brother improsoned by the Japanese waiting on the Allies to liberate the Phillipines. I think those types of things were what affected a great majority of opinions of our troops (and subsequent offsping) because of the brutality and seeming pleasure the Axis went about with their "work".

It's my opinion that the reason we (America, Great Britain and our other allies) take such a strong stance as "the worlds policeman" is that we don't want to stand idly by and watch as the next Hitler, Mussolini, or Hirohito come to power and do nothing about it until it's too late.

There was a special on Pearl Harbor a few weeks ago on the history channel. Included in the program was a reunion between Japanese and American combatants who fought at Pearl so they could forgive and forget. I also remember two or three veterans who were interviewed that said not only would they never forget, but they would never forgive. I for one couldn't blame them because they had seen and lived through all of the horrors of that war. Maybe that is the one Argos is thinking of?

[442w30]

I am an American and also a WWII enthusiast. I had family that fought in both theaters. I'm not saying the comments of these guys should be disregarded--I think they just slightly marred what was otherwise a great film.

I'll try and find which ones in particular I'm talking about (I don't remember exactly what was said or who said it since it's been a few weeks) and if I can I'll post them here. I'd like to hear your take.

At the same time, I do know that Burns' intention was to show the war from a uniquely American viewpoint, so it could be argued that the comments simply added a crude dose of reality.

Cool, like I said, I read something that made me think you weren't. Not a slam.

I agree, it is sad to hear someone honorable say something that makes them sound "small". Sounds like it made it grittier.