A Dealer??

[Razor]

I totally agree with jgcable. It seems all of the really cool guitars get snagged up by the "collectors", and then seem to get flipped en masse six months or so to "thin the herd" or to fund another round of gathering up another load. There are several buyers here in the states who help facilitate the exchanges overseas, and I've always suspected some finders fee money changing hands to get some of these peices "moved" overseas where the demand is higher for them. I'm in agreement here again, anyone who is moving fifty plus guitars a year is running a business.

Since this was brought up, I would like to see a clarification of the posting price rule in the classifieds. I liked the old way where you either put it up for trade offers, or you put a price on it and negotiated via PM if need be. I had ZERO interest in the Kramer that was posted earlier this week, but kept getting "what are you willing to give me" PM's. I thought my sarcasm came shining through, I guess I'll have to be a little more direct the next time. If you want to fish, take it to eBay if you want to know real street value.

[Rich#6]

I think you can tell which ones are dealers and which ones have gas. If the price they are asking is close to what they paid - bro with gas, if it's alot higher dealer/flipper for profit.

[~K~]

Speaking of selling in The Classifieds, I still haven't seen a clarification on posting SALE PRICES on items. Prior to Platinum Membership, I was specifically told that a price had to be included with the sale. To date, I have seen no written changes to indicate things are different for Platinum Membership. Recently, there have been two sellers that listed equipment with no price attached to the sale.

Frankly, I would prefer to NOT list my prices because in all fairness, it's a private deal between me and the buyer. However, if the rules state that we must list a price, I'll play ball. But I think it's only fair that everyone has to play by the same rules.

The purpose of the posted price rule was because several members started doing "Silent Auctions". In at least one of those cases there was some dirty games being played in the background. Because of this we decided to go with a rule on the issue.

Personally my attitude is that we are not ebay and these types of issues should not be here. I personally do not agree with not listing a price on items. I have seen time and time again where people post a sale item with a pm for price and then when you ask you get a "make an offer"

With that stated the glitch in this whole issue is the whole "paid platinum" idea. Do you regulate a section that people have paid to be in? This is something we are discussing presently and once we iron that out we will make it known ...

Dealers/Classifieds.

Several years ago we had a prominent member who would buy up everything he could off ebay before others could get it (lotta backdoor stuff) and then listed in the classifieds with a premium price. (A lot like Carr guitars) He was listing multiple high priced items, several times a week, week after week.

In at least one case a charvel bass was backdoored on ebay for $700 and then 2 days later listed here for $1500. We decided to put a stop to it and it later turned out this person ended up being an internet dealer.

When a known collector lists 25 guitars in one shot I would hardly consider that being a dealer no more than if I liquidated my collection all at once.

We do our best to keep dealers out of the classifieds and get them to be sponsors instead. It isn't fair to the dealers that are already here to let them do that.

With that said~ At times paying dealers have approached me and said they had a personal item to list and was it possible to list it in the classifieds. We will allow that provided it is a personal item and it isn't an abused issue ...

Hope this helps
Have a good weekend

[~K~]

We're gonna fuck around and get off topic, but if I list a doubleneck Gibson and tell you to PM me for a price, how fucking stupid would I look if I quote you one price and John another? Do you think for a moment that people don't discuss sales on these forums? I'm sorry, but my reputation is too good to screw up over a goddamned guitar.

That had in fact happened. IE someone pms the seller and the seller gives him a price and he agrees and askes the seller to hold it for a few days. Someone else comes along so the seller give a higher price and sells it to them for more..

[~K~]

Well, when the new classified section was started, there was an option for bidding like ebay. Somebody did sell a guitar there to a forum member that way, at a pretty cheap price, too. I don't know what happened to that option.

It went out with the uprgade because people hated the new classifieds

[~K~]

No, Matt can't sell his personal guitars if he is dealer. You are either one or the other.. you can't be both.

Nice to know your the authority on this, I'll be sure to check with you in the future on this to make sure it's ok ..

[SEEGERMANY]

Thanks ~K~ for taking time to explain a few things. It's good to know that The Classifieds are being discussed with the possibility of revamping. I suppose that we all have our preferences on how we would like things to be done and I've expressed mine, but I'm also willing to play by the established rules. I do find it a stinking shame that we've had people do the things you described in the past.

[shobet]

There's nothing fishy about pebber, if you bothered to do some research about his history and his collection, you'd know he's not a dealer. Fuck, you should see the stuff he's not selling.

I do agree it would be better with prices though.

[jgcable]

Nice to know your the authority on this, I'll be sure to check with you in the future on this to make sure it's ok ..

I'll rephrase.... Matt shouldn't... not can't.

[jgcable]

There's nothing fishy about pebber, if you bothered to do some research about his history and his collection, you'd know he's not a dealer. Fuck, you should see the stuff he's not selling.

I do agree it would be better with prices though.

If you say so. As far as I know.. the JCF was not created to be a sales outlet. It is intended to be a place where musicians gather who have an interest in Jackson/Charvel guitars and all other musical related items. Basically.. we are supposed to be musicians or fans.
I'm sorry.. call me wrong.. but when a member lists guitars for sale or trade every week and then posts a 25 guitar super listing he is using the JCF as a sales tool.
Thats not cool in my book. When a member is listing 100's of guitars a year its a business and should be in the dealer section of the JCF.. not the classifieds.

[jgcable]

There's nothing fishy about pebber, if you bothered to do some research about his history and his collection, you'd know he's not a dealer. Fuck, you should see the stuff he's not selling.

I do agree it would be better with prices though.

Thats cool.. nothing fishy. I still think that a seller/trader of his magnitude (heck he lists more guitars personally than almost all the JCF'rs combined), should be in the dealer section.
That brings up another point... isn't it unfair that an individual can pay only $20.00 per year to list hundreds of guitars per year but the real dealers have to pay more and only list in the dealer section??

[mattsmusiccenter]

It wasn't me selling one of my personal guitars, although I did advertise a Diezel head in the classifieds a couple years ago and that was my own amp. I think that's the only thing I've ever sold in the classifieds.

A "dealer" is anyone who buys and sells with the intention of making a profit. I know a number of collectrors who buy and sell on a regular basis, but their interests don't involve turning a profit. Of course, I'm sure there are dealers who are moving gear on the side through forums like this and their intent is to turn a profit. Those guys should pay to be here, just like the rest of us dealers.

No, Matt can't sell his personal guitars if he is dealer. You are either one or the other.. you can't be both.
My boss wouldn't let me sell electronics privately even though I love tinkering around with electronics. I am an electronics salesrep by trade. Matt is a guitar salesrep by trade. The only way he could be a private seller is if he ceased to operate Matts Guitars.

[metalchurch79]

Thats cool.. nothing fishy. I still think that a seller/trader of his magnitude (heck he lists more guitars personally than almost all the JCF'rs combined), should be in the dealer section.
That brings up another point... isn't it unfair that an individual can pay only $20.00 per year to list hundreds of guitars per year but the real dealers have to pay more and only list in the dealer section??

If I were selling off equipment on a regular basis, and I was a player, not a collector, I would feel obligated somewhat to pitch in a few bucks toward the forum for allowing me the use of services. Even if I weren't making a profit, and only selling to "thin the herd", or to fund another purchase, I would be grateful for the service and outlet this forum provides.
Now if I were only selling here and there, I dont see it as an issue, but you guys see what I mean.

A $20.00 fee for 1 year is a small price to pay to be in a market with upstanding musicians,sellers,and buyers.
It's a great community filled with awesome people, lets do our damn best to keep it that way.
There's alot of good points being made, and I have confidence that the ultimate decisions on this matter will be made in attempt to please everyone.

I'd also like to say that even though I'm not a platinum member, I do watch the deals and feedback, and I gotta say that in my opinion everyone for the most part is sincere and upfront, and that speaks volumes for not only your own reputation, but for the rep of the entire board.
I'm humbled to be part of this awesome site, you guys all rock!!

[~K~]

I'll rephrase.... Matt shouldn't... not can't.

That's not for you to decide. What irritated me about your statement was that you corrected Newc on something that was fact. Newc was correct and we did in fact allow that.

[jgcable]

That's not for you to decide. What irritated me about your statement was that you corrected Newc on something that was fact. Newc was correct and we did in fact allow that.

Thats correct. Its for you to decide. When did I ever make a decision around here in my 12K+ posts??
I am just stating my opinion in this open forum atmosphere.
Regarding Matt, he is a good guy from what I have heard and he is our main sponsor so I don't want to get off track.

Bottom line.. for me.. IMHO!!!!..... if a person works for a music store or buys, sells or trades guitars as a part time or full time business they should come clean about it and stop with the comments when they list gear in the classifieds like:
having gas
thinning the heard
making room
financially strapped
change of heart

Instead they should say:
I buy, sell and trade guitars as either a part time or full time venture or..
I work at a music store and I come across great deals every day... here is one of them.
Those people should be in the dealer section.. not the classifieds section.