Keep buying crap made in China suckers

[Spivonious]

I hope it doesn't either.

I think the idea of unions is great. Too many companies were treating their workers like crap. But some of them are just getting too greedy. The big ones that come to mind are the UAW and the teachers union. We almost missed a semester in college because the teacher's were going to strike over having to pay for health benefits. That's right, the state was paying 100% of their benefits and they were going to strike because the state wanted to have the teachers pay something like 5%. That's just ridiculous. They already get free college for their kids and only work 9 months of the year.

[DonP]

I agree, but without unions you have greedy CEOs that will fuck everyone in the ass to make an extra penny. Look at the 1900s before unions when fighting between workers and (railroad / oil, etc). People were working 12 hours a day in horrible conditions while the Morgans and Rockefellers(sp?) got rich.

There doesn't seem to be a happy medium.

[Endrik]

They already get free college for their kids and only work 9 months of the year.

based on how Mark describes the situation, in their position I'd also strike to get free blowjobs, free pack of Xanax for every week, early retirement, huge pension and one way ticket to Tahiti.

[AK47]

I agree, but without unions you have greedy CEOs that will fuck everyone in the ass to make an extra penny. Look at the 1900s before unions when fighting between workers and (railroad / oil, etc). People were working 12 hours a day in horrible conditions while the Morgans and Rockefellers(sp?) got rich.

There doesn't seem to be a happy medium.

Times have changed we dont need unions anymore. We have labor laws and OSHA now. Unions are killing this country.

Regarding the Health Care remark about having a heart attack and the clinic not treating you because of no insurance is BS.

The media and politicians lead you to beleive without universal healthcare the ERs are letting people die and bleed to death in the ERs which is BS. They have to treat you if you go to the ER.

Look at how many illegals are using the ER for their primary care. Everyone gets treated and billed but illegals dont pay because they have no ID.

Newc's a closet commie and Fuck Toejam!

[bibz]

I like supporting Australia, so I buy asian stuff. We're a commodity based economy, so the more asian industry builds, the more resources they need from our great brown land. (this is quite toungue in cheek )

Ironically G, I was told Soniq was started by the guy that owns JB Hifi. Uses parts from other manufacturers to get them built to his spec and distributes the products within his shops to get the prices down, building upon his nationwide infrastructure. Pretty good thinkin'.

The largest workforce industry locally is the automotive industry I think. It's having hard times right now obviously, but instead of laying people off, Holden is introducing a roster system where everyone works less hours on the production line. Noone will go hungry that way. I'm sure things will return to normal soon, and production will be ramped back up. But they don't have the clusterfuck of the UAW to deal with...I'm sure theres unions covering them though.

The UAW situation is brutal. GM can't afford the stress they cause, and the UAW still isn't getting satisfactory results. The reason imo? The lobbying the southern states do to retard government help to GM. Southern states are home to toyota/lexus/mazda etc. and can afford much better conditions and still outprice GM with a better recieved product. I say some string tightening needs to happen. Tax imports for domestic advantage (as we do here). This needs to be done for chinese product imports aswell. Noones ever going to see an american made tv again, but I'm sure theres alot of conflict between local industry, local jobs, and a far too 'free' trade with china and india etc. Impose a strict employment fee for indian call centres and watch the jobs come back. And english be spoke on the phone again!

[hippietim]

You conserviative guys do realize the conflict in your statements, don't you?

Unions suck, we need more open free trade, deregulate business, etc. but CEOs make too much money and the average worker is getting screwed.

More free trade, deregulation, and abolishing unions are the steps to take to positively guarantee that CEOs will make shit tons of money and the average worker will get paid peanuts if they are actually able to get a job at all.

Face it folks, pure capitalism and "let the market decide" economics only works if you're at the top.

Left unchecked, capitalism is survival of the fittest. And maybe 1% of us would end up being part of the fittest. The rest are screwed.

How many of you *really* believe in captitalism, deregulation, free trade, etc.? Because there ain't no anti-trust laws in that world. And corporations would be free to dump shit in your ponds. Hopefully you guys are all ready to work in the food service industry or retail - because anybody that produces anything won't have a job once the remainder of jobs are farmed overseas unless we go back to sweat shop labor. How do you feel about your children having to work so you can pay your rent? Retirement? Ha! What's that? Do you guys really believe the bullshit mantra that if you want things to change you'd vote with you wallet? How's that working for you now?

[atomic charvel guy]

decent points Tim. The rich have been doing it to the poor since the beginning of time. I'm talking about the "rich", not the successful 6 figure a year guy, but the liquid guys who call the shots.
And by the way,
I sold some IT parts reverse engineered in China and it got me in more trouble than anyone would ever want to be in. My own stupidiy here though, nobody else to blame but myself.

[Spivonious]

Times have changed we dont need unions anymore. We have labor laws and OSHA now. Unions are killing this country.

Regarding the Health Care remark about having a heart attack and the clinic not treating you because of no insurance is BS.

The media and politicians lead you to beleive without universal healthcare the ERs are letting people die and bleed to death in the ERs which is BS. They have to treat you if you go to the ER.

Look at how many illegals are using the ER for their primary care. Everyone gets treated and billed but illegals dont pay because they have no ID.

Newc's a closet commie and Fuck Toejam!

Oh I didn't mean to imply that the ER wouldn't treat the guy, just that it's not really something that can be bartered, like a banana or a new car. Hence, capitalism does not work with healthcare.

And Tim, I'd really like to see what a completely free market society looks like. As far as I know, there has never been one. I don't know about you, but if the CEO is getting filthy rich off of my work and I'm making diddly squat, I'm looking for another job. Ideally, if the company makes money, the workers make money.

Someone brought up Rockefeller, Carnegie, and the super rich of the early 20th century. Yes they were super rich, but look at all the things they gave to society. Carnegie built a concert hall in NYC and a university in Pittsburgh. Modern day parallel, Bill Gates. Lots of money, spends it all trying to eradicate diseases in third-world countries. Not everyone is greedy and selfish.

[rjohnstone]

Tim, you won't here me say anything about having a pure capitalistic environment as I agree, it would be pure lunacy.
Laws and regulations need to be in place to protect the worker.
What I don't agree on is the need for unions. They are blood sucking leeches on both their members and the companies that use them.
GM should have let the last UAW contract expire and switch to the same model that Honda of Alabama uses. I can guarantee that those UAW workers would love to still get a paycheck from GM as a non-union worker than no paycheck at all.

The fact that the UAW will pay you even when there is no work tells me that they are gouging companies and other union members to make that paycheck happen.
No wonder these guys don't want to give up the union.
That is complete and utter bullshit.

[CharvelRocker]

The other fact of the matter of Unions is this: They are as bad as the companies their members work for. All they care about is getting their money. In that sense, they both screw out the working Joe. The time of Union's usefulness is so far gone it's not funny anymore. To an extent, the lawyer and media relation's specialist has taken the place of the Union in "fighting" for "fair" and "safe" working environments *cough*

[Endrik]

How many of you *really* believe in captitalism,

Capitalism is based on one human nature characters... greed.

Capitalism is ok in moderation except in a couple of areas like health, food and creative arts.

The most extreme forms of capitalism has caused a lot of shit over the years... it's the case when greed becomes number 1 and everything else doesn't matter at all.

A good example is Soviet Union. While little McCarthys who have safely sat in their chairs for their whole life and the only thing they know about Communistic Dictatorship is based on stuff like Fox news, may say that USSR existed because of anti-capitalism and whatnot...

But the reality is that those leaders who created Soviet Union were one of the biggest capitalists ever. All that "everyone are equal", "let's share everything" "working class rules" bullshit was a propaganda for all the stupid sheep. But the leaders were motivated by greed, they didn't give a shit about the people (they let millions to starve, what a brother-love that is), they wanted all the stuff under their control. They were so good capitalists that they knew how to remove all the competition. A lot of competing businessmen and intellectuals were murdered. All the money making machines were gathered under their control.
You think when the Soviet leaders gathered together, to have their "board meeting", discussed about Marx theories? Fuck no. They didn't give a shit about that. They made plans how to make money, money and more money, and how to get all that money for themselves, to get even more money and more power. They were all ridiculously rich and had so much power.
And like Nazi germany or any other dictatorship... many capitalist businessmen from US, UK, Holland, Germany etc. secretly invested their money into their power because in return they got more money out of it.

Putin who has been described as the next Stalin was just a KGB thug... but when he came to the power.... during his administration he became one of the richest men on the planet. How the fuck can a President earn as much as Bill Gates. Specially a president who outside seems like an anti-capitalist, who creates a police state and limits economic freedom. He just removes the limits and competition to get all the money into his pockets. He is an extreme capitalist.

That's why it's a fucking stupid idea to have a 100% capitalist world order. Businesses need to be controlled somewhat so that every douchebag CEO or invester with a Napoleon complex doesn't get the idea that he is free to become the next Stalin, Hitler, Franco or any other shithead.

[Wayniac]

I agree with Tim as far as the quality and safety of Chinese-made stuff. They do not heat treat the metals in their tools (cheap screwdrivers, etc), they have lead in everything, cheat and put urea in foods.. WTF! They should have the same standards/regulations that our businesses need to deal with - environmental regs, pollution regs, an equivalent of OSHA.. then see how much those prices go up! Bet we'd see some work coming back into the US, and a helluva lot less recalls and safety warnings

I have been on a mission to attempt to buy non-Chinese whenever feasible (even if it means paying more $$).. and it is damn hard! Though Tim has made it clear on his gun stance, so not sure if this is a great example - .. I did purchase firearms and a compound bow last year.. all US made (Mossberg, Remington, Ruger, Mathews Bow). I also bought a Plano case that was made in the US (not all Plano stuff is US made anymore).. but when assembling... the rentention straps in the case were from China! ARGH! lol. I try to avoid Sprawlmart and Target as much as possible... they are some of the biggest high volume Chinese importers.

As far as Unions - i work in a Union shop, but am a salary employee,. I see good and evil on boths sides.. there are deadbeats but also many skilled, hardworking guys in the Union. There are also some less than stellar performers in salary/management - that have, say - decided to outsource to try to save $$, wihout looking at the FULL picture and FULL business impact. I think the current state of affairs in the US is a combination of the "lottery" mentality/sense of entitlement and need for instant gratification, and greed and poor decisons without full accountability.

Anyway - my 2 cents for whatever that is worth...

[Shawn Lutz]

Newc, skilled doesn't mean college educated ;0 I know MBA's who are dumb as pile bricks, they are highly skilled in ass-kissing, good BS'ers and play golf pretty good

[FlyingSkull]

I blame Obama for the resurgence of class warfare. Sometimes it's hard to tell if I'm breathing the fumes of cabbage and vodka of early 20th century Eastern Europe or hanging with cannabis filled Frenchmen of the late '40s.

[Partial @ Marshall]

"Hecho in China" funny ass sticker

Americans still grow the best weed in the world, and have the hottest strippers...we're #1!