WIP Song composition

[Cliff]

So after I recorded my last jam over a blues track, my daughter said it'd sound better if I actually listened properly to the chords I was playing over.
This got me to thinking that I should try and write a melody or two in the hopes of improving my improvisation skills. Here's the result:

http://soundcloud.com/cliffievanr/songwip

The main melody here is actually based on a classical piece I heard 20 or more years ago, and it's stuck in my mind ever since. I'm hoping that my poor memory and poor sense of pitch are such that the melody's changed enough that I can call it my own . Between the main melody are two variations, one I came up with a couple of weeks ago and the second something I came up with this afternoon.

I'd appreciate your thoughts and comments as always.

[Endrik]

The tune sounds more like spaghetti western soundtrack (not a negative comment), just remove the drum beat and add some horns, harmonica, flute, timpani hits etc. to make it crazier... listen to Ennio Morricone for ideas.

Writing a melody doesn't necessarily improve improvisation. You have to work out how different notes sound over different chords and then work on connecting different parts over chord changes. This is elementary in jazz music for example. You don't have to follow the changes just by playing the tonic, third and fifth... 4ths, 6ths, 7ths, 9ths, 11ths, 13ths or tritone and passing tones etc. can sound excellent, each note adds its own colour, just mess around to see which colours you like the best over certain chords. Then find ways how chords are connected to each other. For example the notes in C major chord (C, E, G) are 7th, 9th and 11th in D minor, F major chord (F, A, G) are 3rd, 5th and 7th in D minor, A minor chord (A, C, E) are 5th, 7th and 9th in D minor.

The reason why a lot of soloing in rock music sounds bland and harmonically stale is because most players follow certain box shapes and scales rather what makes the harmony stand out. Try voice leading and more chordal approach. Playing over changes where you can't stay in the same key is a great way to practice because it forces you out of the comfort zone. For example Miles Davis changes from "Tune Up" is a great for practicing, there's three tonic centers, D, C and Bb and the changes are basic ii-V-I turnaround, Em7(ii), A7(V), DM7(first I), Dm7(ii), G7(V), CM7(second I), Cm7(ii), F7(V), BbM7(third I). You can remove the 7ths from the chords if you want or move them to some other key. It's a great for improving improvisation and harmonic understanding.

[Cliff]

Thanks for the comments and tips.
I see what you mean about the spaghetti western feel, though that was far from my mind when I was writing it.
"Writing a melody doesn't necessarily improve improvisation" - understood, but an appreciation of how a melody works over chords can't do any harm. Although this is pretty basic stuff, it's something I've never tried before. In this particular case, the main melody was already there, and I figured out the chords that would accompany it. Then I kept the chords (with one small variation) and tried to figure out the melodic variations (which, coincidence or not, are weaker). To do this, I did indeed think in terms of 1st, 3rd and 5th for each chord. But yeah, I realize I could be using 7ths, 6ths etc, but I wanted to keep things simple for now.
You're right - I'm trying to escape the box. Recently, the box has gotten bigger as I've learned the scales across the fretboard rather than in just one position, but it's still a box. I'll check out 'Tune Up', but I've got a feeling it may be too advanced for me at the moment.
Anyway, I appreciate you taking the time to listen and make suggestions.

[Endrik]

It all depends of the situation. If there's already an harmony then one often doesn't have to play 1st and 5th as the other instruments, for example the bass is already doing that and the 5th usually isn't a "strong" note to emphasize the harmony although sometimes playing the main theme in 5ths over the chords sounds very good. 3rds are of course very strong, 6th was very common in european classical music, 7ths and tension notes (9,11,13) add more distinct flavour.

Jazz voice leading and comping is usually 3rds, 7ths and certain tension notes. In earlier european classical music 3rds and 6ths were very dominant and also it was common to avoid parallel 5ths, which means if you play 5th over one chord then you do not play the 5th over the next chord to make the melody or solo to really stand out.

Whatever the case, scalar approach often doesn't add any harmonic strength, it's just all the notes in the scale in ascending or descending order so nothing really stands out. But paying more attention to chord tones makes you sound more together with the other musicians or the music you play along with. In rock music Marty Friedman tends to really emphasize the chord changes.

There's bunch of other things happening in "Tune Up" but you can take the 3x ii-V-I chord progression and record it or program it and play it in any tempo you like. It's not too complicated as the tonal centers are close to each other, full step away and for example when something resolves to I then at the same position changing the 3rd and 7th you'll get ii for the next turnaround (I DM7->ii Dm7 and I CM7->ii Cm7).
The Em7-A7-DM7 are in D, Dm7-G7-CM7 are in C and Cm7-F7-BbM7 are in Bb. First you can approach each ii-V-I more modally but as you get more comfortable with the changes then you can start paying more attention to each chord.
The great thing about this is that you can't play modally in a single key, it forces you think more about what is happening around you.
As you go along you'll find many interesting resolutions, for example over V7 you can experiment with diminished sounds as V7 is sometimes substituted with a chord which tonic is a tritone for V7.
Great exercise, Coltrane used it for the base for his famous Changes which are in "Giant Steps", where you got the same ii-V-I or V-I turnarounds or simply I in 3 different keys only the keys are a lot further apart, hence Giant Steps and played at rapid speed.

But constructing harmony to a melody is a totally different thing of course unless it's comping. Pure composition where one needs to take time to make sure all the harmonies sound good and interesting.

[Cliff]

The Em7-A7-DM7 are in D, Dm7-G7-CM7 are in C and Cm7-F7-BbM7 are in Bb. First you can approach each ii-V-I more modally but as you get more comfortable with the changes then you can start paying more attention to each chord.

Great advice, thanks - this is where I'll start. I've just had a quick listen to it: great tune, but I think I'll be playing at a slower tempo .
BTW When you say "playing over the changes", do you mean creating phrases that continue as the key changes beneath, as opposed to say playing a phrase in D, pausing, playing another in C, etc?

[Endrik]

Playing over the changes is when you play over each chord in a way which makes each chord stand out, emphasizing the chord tones rather than coldly playing whatever mode there happens to be. The phrase can continue over the changes, as you practice you'll start to realize how to connect the dots. A simple example is if you make a phrase out of arpeggio which goes 1-3-5-7-9-11-13. So if we take ii-V-I in C with changes Dm7-G7-CM7, so starting the arpeggio in D you get the notes D, F, A, C, E, G, B. You see that the 1 and 3, 11 and 13 of that D arpeggio are 5 and 7, 1 and 3 for the G7 change and 7, 9, 11 and 13 from D are 1, 3, 5 and 7 for CM7 change.
But when you start for the first time then yes, pretty much it's a phrase in D pause, phrase in C etc. as the brain is not used to it yet, not that here's anything wrong with phrases with pauses, it just takes time to develop long flowing phrases which go over multiple changes.

[Trem]

Sounds good Cliff. Sounds like success. Thanks, you've started a thread that again is motivating me to practice stuff out of my norm, that i should be practicing.

Endrik thanks for sharing that. I have been wanting to practice progressions like this as i have an over whelming feeling that things need to resolve when i play. It takes a bit for my ear to hear progressions like this as a flowing entity, they tend to sound like they are rambling on and on to my ear. But always resolving to the obvious is annoying me too. I'll be having a go at it and try to digest that Miles tune a bit to hear what you are describing. I pretty much usually dislike the sound of trumpets/horns as lead instruments. I know the guys a legend and all and i've heard some amazing shredding shit of his, i just wished it was a bass or something, lol, But when the piano comes in i can get into that.

[Endrik]

There's many ways to approach resolution. Be-Bop based jazz players of course practice over II-V-I progression until they are nuts. The main thing for them is to focus on guide tones (mainly 3rds and 7ths and sometimes tension notes) when making melodies or just blasting crazy lines so the voice leading would stand out. Charlie Parker liked to use a lot of 7ths and tension notes like 9ths and 11ths when playing over very simple chords to add different colour.

There's something called direct approach, basically the line resolves to guide tones when the chord starts to change.
Let's take very simple example in C with the good old II-V-I.
For example we got lead line with these notes over the changes.
Over Dm7: D, F, A, C. Over G7: B, D, G, F. Over CM7: just sustained E note.
As we can see the the line over Dm7 ends with C which is 7th for Dm7, it goes half step down to B when the G7 change comes in and B is 3rd for G7. The line over G7 ends with F which is 7th for G7 and goes half step down to E for resolution when the CM7 comes in and E is 3rd for CM7.
So basically one change ends with 7th, goes half step down which is 3rd for the next chord.

Then there's indirect approach where you put a note between the 7th and 3rd which occurs over the change. For example you put extra A between C and B when the Dm7->G7 change happens and extra G between F and E when the G7->CM7 change happens.
But with chromatic approach you add Bb between C and B... and Eb between F and E. And note half step below the resolving 3rd. This creates a very bluesy feel.
Double indirect approach is when you add A and Bb between C and B... and D and Eb between F and E. This is if you dig chromaticism.

There's so many ways, no rules, these are just some examples one can keep in mind and develop something out of it.

European classical music has so many different ways how to approach cadence. There's plenty of II-V-I turnarounds too.
There's a lot of half cadences which end in weaker sounding 5 as you always don't want to end every turnaround with full "bang" if the solo or theme continues.

One of my favourites is Wagner's approach in "Tristan und Isolde" opera's prelude of the first act. The melodies resolve into a dissonant harmonies and there's some chromaticism going on in the melody but it all sounds so beautiful and impressive.

It's good to practice over any kind of chord progression. The melodies and soloing gets better the more one understands how harmony works. How notes sound over a chord and how notes sound when the chord has a specific function (tonic, subdominant, dominant) meaning if the the music resolves into that chord or it is a starting point or something in between for forward motion.

Even if the music consists of some static chord vamp or a drone, if you imagine in your head that there are some chord changes going on and start playing accordingly then it creates much more depth and movement to the music.

It's all about the harmony, one can combine all kinds of pentatonic licks, chromaticism, dissonant runs, modal patterns etc. but when the focus is still on certain chord tones then the the music sounds more "together" rather than soloist versus the band.

[Endrik]

"Tune Up" is a standard so there's plenty of versions where the soloist is something other than trumpet. One really doesn't even have to care about it or jazz in general, those changes are just great for developing musical vocabulary. Harmonic understanding is essential for any kind of music if one wants to create something substantial.

Jazz just has so much great examples where one can learn about improvisation with harmonic depth.
At first jazz was pretty simple music (it is pop music after all) but then a group of intelligent african americans weren't satisfied that jazz is just an entertainment, they went to New York City and created something which is called be-bop, a music which essentially has a short melodic theme (head) while most of the tune consists of ridiculously technical soloing over chord changes. And this music which is showcasing high skill in improvisation and harmony was actually popular in the 40's.
It started out by just playing over the changes of simple tunes from "American Songbook" etc. Charlie Parker practiced soloing for many tunes in all 12 keys, it really helped to connect the dots.
Most of the developments in jazz after be-bop were something where Miles Davis was a central figure, he lacked the chops to be a full on be-bopper so he made other styles where improvisation and harmony were very dependent of mood and tonality.
So one doesn't have to be a be-bop. wiz to be a great improviser.

If we listen to some old school blues based rock players who have to play over more complex harmony, most of them including Clapton who has played with many jazz schooled musicians still resolve to blues pentatonic box. But Jeff Beck is capable of creating very beautiful lines on the spot, he is not a Charlie Parker on the guitar but he is very aware what's going on musically.

[Cliff]

Thanks, you've started a thread that again is motivating me to practice stuff out of my norm, that i should be practicing..

You're welcome . I must admit I've not paid much attention to Marty Friedman, but after Endrik mentioned him in this context, I found this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBla_X3Tvdc

It's a bit simpler than Tuned Up, since it doesn't have the key change, but I think it's very impressive how much he gets out three basic chords.

[Trem]

Yeah that is one of my favorite guitar instructional vids. I was reminded of it when he mentioned Marty too. Good one to revisit. I have it on VHS, which does me no good atm, lol. Well luckily there you tube.

Cliff, if you haven't really listened to him, or never was into the cacophony stuff or megadeth, you should check out his solo album Scenes, it's nothing like that stuff, it's more like new age or something, lol, anyway i think it's his best work period and it's full of that kind of stuff that he's teaching in that vid.


Now off to read Endriks last few posts.

[Mr Sandman]

I thought it was a sound effort Cliff...

The `spag western` theme rings with me too. It`s not something I`d go out of my way to listen to, but it`s `listenable`. You know what I mean?

The only criticism I have is that when the guitar with that little bit of gain enters, you sound nervous. It`s sounds like a separate take and when you hit the record button you were uncomfortable, and I can hear it.
Would you consider trying a few more takes of that part (if you can) and sliding it in there? Just to see what happens?
Also, have you ever tried drugs and alcohol? I`m not condoning it, just asking, that`s all...
Again, with the above mentioned part I was expecting the big full volume band entry, with the big double stop bends. It sort of left me hanging for it... So you got me there... It prolly does other things to other people though...

I can`t help out with the music theory talk. I only just learnt what an a,, anrp, an arperggio is, lol

Keep up the good work!

[Cliff]

Yeah that is one of my favorite guitar instructional vids. I was reminded of it when he mentioned Marty too. Good one to revisit. I have it on VHS, which does me no good atm, lol. Well luckily there you tube.

Cliff, if you haven't really listened to him, or never was into the cacophony stuff or megadeth, you should check out his solo album Scenes, it's nothing like that stuff, it's more like new age or something, lol, anyway i think it's his best work period and it's full of that kind of stuff that he's teaching in that vid.


Now off to read Endriks last few posts.

I'll give Scenes a try. I shared a flat with a beginning drummer in the 80s who formed a trash band. It pretty much put me off the entire genre, so my Megadeath and Metallica exposure is pretty limited. I know, my bad.

Regarding Endrik's posts - lots of info there - thanks again Endrik! - I think, for me at least, it's going to take a good while to digest all that and put it into practice.

[Cliff]

I thought it was a sound effort Cliff...

The `spag western` theme rings with me too. It`s not something I`d go out of my way to listen to, but it`s `listenable`. You know what I mean?

The only criticism I have is that when the guitar with that little bit of gain enters, you sound nervous. It`s sounds like a separate take and when you hit the record button you were uncomfortable, and I can hear it.
Would you consider trying a few more takes of that part (if you can) and sliding it in there? Just to see what happens?
Also, have you ever tried drugs and alcohol? I`m not condoning it, just asking, that`s all...
Again, with the above mentioned part I was expecting the big full volume band entry, with the big double stop bends. It sort of left me hanging for it... So you got me there... It prolly does other things to other people though...

I can`t help out with the music theory talk. I only just learnt what an a,, anrp, an arperggio is, lol

Keep up the good work!

Thanks!
You're totally right about the nervy sounding part (funny how obvious it comes across, isn't it?). I'd only just figured it out, so I was still worried my fingers wouldn't find the right notes at the right time. In retrospect, I think it stands out too much, and I wondered I'd be better off playing it clean like the rest. Or, as you say, it should get bigger, and have a bigger accompaniment. I wanted to have something like a chorus, but so far inspiration has failed. But I'll definitely try re-recording once I do have some better ideas. Another direction I thought about was to keep it very short and sweet - I really like the Smiths song that's played in the gallery scene in Ferris Beuller's Day Off - I think one of the strengths is that it leaves you wanting to hear more (not that my little melody can compare in any way).

Drugs and alcohol? I have enough trouble playing in time and hitting the right notes sober .

[Endrik]

I strongly encourage anyone to practice over changes where one can't stay in the same key. It simply makes you pay more attention to what's going on in any musical situation. I'm very disappointed when some highly rated musicians have no respect for the music and for musicians they are playing along with when they ignore what's going on and just play pre-learned finger exercises in the main key position over everything. Some actually think they're the shit for doing that, I instantly want to throw changes with different keys to them so everyone could see what kind of charlatans they really are when the fail miserably in musical communication.

There's no science behind it. It's just hearing and acknowledging the harmony which thrives the music. Almost anyone can do it at basic level, you hear chord changes and you automatically sing with the changes. Just adapt that approach with an instrument and develop more advance language out of it.
Theory is just a collection of regularities which are labeled with certain names. If you work on your playing, figuring out what sounds good and what doesn't, transcribing the music you like etc. then you know what's going on anyway regardless if you know the name for the approach you can get from music theory book or not. The names are good when you want to talk about something and address the info quickly. Like 3rd interval or something like that, you just count if you have to, nothing hard there.

It's all about listening and adapting.