Need help with phrasing and polyrhythmic

[Miffy rules]

How do you guys work on phrasing? Sometimes I don't know if it's a matter of feeling or of precision regarding this phrasing thing. I have no idea in which direction should I be going: the feeling of the solo, or just nail the timing deadly.

A related question is polyrhythmic. I'm referring to the Zappa style polyrhythmic solo. Now THAT is totally out there. I have no fucking clure how to work through those odd timeing and phrasing, especially when he, well, "shreds".

[LesPaulCustom]

Re: Need help with phrasing and polyrhythmic

The best way I have found for phrasing is to think in terms of the human voice or the sax....it took me a long time to develop a good vibrato I was happy with and sounded musical, not mechanical.

Technique is just the vehicle to get your ideas across, nothing more or less. Everybody plays differently, and there are a few "steadfast" methods, but everybody is an individual. My picking patterns won't be yours, but the same result is achieved, so who is right or wrong??

It comes together naturally after a while....it is just practice and what you put into it what results you get.

[nor]

Re: Need help with phrasing and polyrhythmic

Try NOT starting with the note you (naturally)want to start with, and not ending the way you (naturally) want to end.

That oughta screw you up.
Heh.

[TB]

Re: Need help with phrasing and polyrhythmic

On the phrasing thing, I'm with LPCustom; voice & horns are by default the instruments to emulate, as they can not be played without breathing... whereas a guitar can be wanked on endlessly as long as your fingers will cooperate... try recording specific chord progressions that you wish to improve your phrasing for - then record yourself "scat singing" improvisations over the changes - finally, go back & learn to play what you sang, on the instrument, complete with all the subtle nuances of your vocal inflections. You can also spend your time very wisely as you're driving around in your car - be it with a CD of material I'm working on, or just arbitrary tunes on the radio, I constantly either scat sing improvs, or sing harmonies at different intervals, to whatever tune I'm hearing. If you do this often enough, as well as spend some time analyzing, your phrasing will improve. I would also recommend getting a strong handle on intervals via ear training.

The polyrhythmic thing has always kicked my butt sideways, & I've only recently had to delve fairly seriously into that. The first thing to do is to know what in fact the time signature is - if it's in "5", or "7", or "5 + 4", etc., you need to be able to first count it before you can effectively play or improvise over it. Try taking any familiar melodic sequence & work with a metronome, & break the lines into different subdivisions (groups of 3,4,5,6, & so on); try playing your lines, patterns, & licks with both a "3" feel & a "4" feel, as well as placing accents on different beats within the count.

[Miffy rules]

Re: Need help with phrasing and polyrhythmic

Thanks a lot everyone! [img]graemlins/toast.gif[/img]