Completely chaning my approach to guitar

[UFORocks]

So I recently had an epiphany about my playing. I suck.

I realized that my entire approach to learning and playing is just wrong for me. The combination of; inconsistency, self teaching, reliance on tablature, and a complete failure to commit to learn about music and music theory, has really stunted my growth as a guitar player and musician. And I have no one to blame but myself.

One thing that really kills me is all the time and effort I spent learning other musician's work with nothing to show for it. Except that I memorized a bunch of songs written by other people, and still have no clue how to use that knowledge to write my own music the way I want to.

It's like trying to learn spanish by watching Telemundo or UniVision and then trying to write a spanish language book.

So last night I dug up my old William Leavitt books and started back at page one. The plan is to work back to where I was before I stopped taking lessons, and then go back to taking lessons. I can only hope that my former teacher will recognize my commitment this time around and take me back as a student.

I really was a better guitar player back then, and I've only gotten worse since I stopped taking lessons.

-Steve

[jgcable]

So I recently had an epiphany about my playing. I suck.

I realized that my entire approach to learning and playing is just wrong for me. The combination of; inconsistency, self teaching, reliance on tablature, and a complete failure to commit to learn about music and music theory, has really stunted my growth as a guitar player and musician. And I have no one to blame but myself.

One thing that really kills me is all the time and effort I spent learning other musician's work with nothing to show for it. Except that I memorized a bunch of songs written by other people, and still have no clue how to use that knowledge to write my own music the way I want to.

It's like trying to learn spanish by watching Telemundo or UniVision and then trying to write a spanish language book.

So last night I dug up my old William Leavitt books and started back at page one. The plan is to work back to where I was before I stopped taking lessons, and then go back to taking lessons. I can only hope that my former teacher will recognize my commitment this time around and take me back as a student.

I really was a better guitar player back then, and I've only gotten worse since I stopped taking lessons.

-Steve

Whatever it takes to spark interest and growth. There is nothing wrong with any of the things you have been doing btw...
Most of the best guitarists on the planet are self taught and learned by mlearning styles from their favorite guitar players.
Theory isn't what its all cracked up to be bro. Just ask most pro guitar players. What you need to learn is to play from the heart and make every note count regardless of if you don't know what the notes or patterns are called. To tell you the truth.. most of the guitar players that I know that are robotic and play with little to no feel but have tons of technical ability are all theory players. I did many guitar wars back in the day and I would always beat the theory players by playing cool meaningful shit that the crowd remembered. I don't ever remember a Berkley "theory" type player winning one. I used to be a meedly meedly player concerned on modes, scales, notes per second and impressing the crowd and other guitar players. Nobody remembered any of the solo's I played unless we were doing a cover tune. They would comment that my original solo's were good but they weren't memorable. I toned my style down alot and I only play what I feel and hear in my head. I call it "counter melody soloing". My solo's have been getting rave reviews from critics all over satellite radio. Theory is for scientists.

[horns666]

John G spoke my gospel!!! It was like I wrote it myself but without all the "fuggums" in it. I always thought of John being more of a theory guy, but his approach and attitude is much like my own. Wow!

I was going to teach at my cousins store. He really wanted me there because I'm a pretty decent player. He assumed I knew theory..I don't at all. He gave me a basic Mel Bay book to learn so I could teach. That was about 6 years ago. So I gave the book to my son. I didn't even have the desire to bother at that point.

I never learned other people's music, just my favorite bits and pieces. Basically amp tweaking riffs. I learned lots of basslines but that's easy for me. Everything I play is my own crap. I get an idea and I just noodle around until I geti it or something completely different. Most of the stuff I come up with is by chance. I don't tape any of my ideas, so I guess my favorite riffs stay in my head. I forgot much more than I remember. But if I can't remember it, I guess it wasn't worth that much to me...but I'm sure some would be usable. I'm strictly a metal player on guitar but on bass I could sit in with any band in any style without a prob. I'm kinda gifted when it comes to bass, it's natural, and I put alot of time slappin N' tappin' away to a drum machine for years. I cultivated a style of my own that sparked when I saw Tony Levin in '81 with a Chapman stick. I just applied that to bass. I love fusion and funk because metal is boring for the most part. So, I took that as far as I could, and I put it down for years at a time without getting a bit rusty..it's weird.

My favorite, metal guitarist and inspiration is Jeff Loomis since '97. He never applied theory to his stuff, but sure seems like it. That dude started playing at 14 and blew away Mustaine at 16. He was too young for Megadeth, so he advised his buddy Marty about the gig. We hang out and bullshit whenever they come here. Eveyone asks him how does he come up with this music. He always says "I get an idea and I just go for it". He had a column in Guitar world for a short time but he bailed because he couldn't explain what he plays. So he learned the basics so he can convey what he does.

Not knowing theory and learning other people's music has been my biggest blessing as a player. I just do my own thing that is very inspired by everthing.

Here's the bottom line when it comes to a being "good" musician IMO. Feel, meter, and groove is mandatory. It is more natural to some than others. You can know all theory in the world, but with that foundation, it won't sound good.

My main link to creativity and writers block for 30 years. I constantly buy new music. I'm hearing it for the first time.If something instantly kicks my ass and sparks an idea..I'll turn it off before I heard the rest of it. So, I take what clicked in my head, and go right to the guitar. I fumble around 'till I get somewhat close and run with it. Sometimes my idea is similair to what the song actually sounds like, but most of the time it's not even close. Sometimes it's for the better. Then I got a new riff, and I put in my head with the others. My singer/bud is such a huge help. I have all these riffs/ideas and sometimed I don't know how to apply them, sometimes I structure an entire song in one shot. Those are the best ones! I show him riffs , he picks the ones he wants, arranges them and how many times it repeats. He's the singer, he knows how he wants it to go. It works. The goal is making good music. It doesn't matter how you get there, as long as you do.

Learning the basics would be a great. I should learn it, but I wont. I've been playingh since I was 13 and I'm going on 45 now. I can write songs without a prob. I have friend really into theory and they're some technical, amazing fuckers. But they're creativity is lame. There's one talented progressive metal dude that writes 30 minute epics that don't go anywhere..and you're begging to please make it stop. That's fucked up.

Sorry for the ramble or typos..I'm actually really baked right now. So, I'm doin' good.

[jgcable]

John G spoke my gospel!!! It was like I wrote it myself but without all the "fuggums" in it. I always thought of John being more of a theory guy, but his approach and attitude is much like my own. Wow!

I was going to teach at my cousins store. He really wanted me there because I'm a pretty decent player. He assumed I knew theory..I don't at all. He gave me a basic Mel Bay book to learn so I could teach. That was about 6 years ago. So I gave the book to my son. I didn't even have the desire to bother at that point.

I never learned other people's music, just my favorite bits and pieces. Basically amp tweaking riffs. I learned lots of basslines but that's easy for me. Everything I play is my own crap. I get an idea and I just noodle around until I geti it or something completely different. Most of the stuff I come up with is by chance. I don't tape any of my ideas, so I guess my favorite riffs stay in my head. I forgot much more than I remember. But if I can't remember it, I guess it wasn't worth that much to me...but I'm sure some would be usable. I'm strictly a metal player on guitar but on bass I could sit in with any band in any style without a prob. I'm kinda gifted when it comes to bass, it's natural, and I put alot of time slappin N' tappin' away to a drum machine for years. I cultivated a style of my own that sparked when I saw Tony Levin in '81 with a Chapman stick. I just applied that to bass. I love fusion and funk because metal is boring for the most part. So, I took that as far as I could, and I put it down for years at a time without getting a bit rusty..it's weird.

My favorite, metal guitarist and inspiration is Jeff Loomis since '97. He never applied theory to his stuff, but sure seems like it. That dude started playing at 14 and blew away Mustaine at 16. He was too young for Megadeth, so he advised his buddy Marty about the gig. We hang out and bullshit whenever they come here. Eveyone asks him how does he come up with this music. He always says "I get an idea and I just go for it". He had a column in Guitar world for a short time but he bailed because he couldn't explain what he plays. So he learned the basics so he can convey what he does.

Not knowing theory and learning other people's music has been my biggest blessing as a player. I just do my own thing that is very inspired by everthing.

Here's the bottom line when it comes to a being "good" musician IMO. Feel, meter, and groove is mandatory. It is more natural to some than others. You can know all theory in the world, but with that foundation, it won't sound good.

My main link to creativity and writers block for 30 years. I constantly buy new music. I'm hearing it for the first time.If something instantly kicks my ass and sparks an idea..I'll turn it off before I heard the rest of it. So, I take what clicked in my head, and go right to the guitar. I fumble around 'till I get somewhat close and run with it. Sometimes my idea is similair to what the song actually sounds like, but most of the time it's not even close. Sometimes it's for the better. Then I got a new riff, and I put in my head with the others. My singer/bud is such a huge help. I have all these riffs/ideas and sometimed I don't know how to apply them, sometimes I structure an entire song in one shot. Those are the best ones! I show him riffs , he picks the ones he wants, arranges them and how many times it repeats. He's the singer, he knows how he wants it to go. It works. The goal is making good music. It doesn't matter how you get there, as long as you do.

Learning the basics would be a great. I should learn it, but I wont. I've been playingh since I was 13 and I'm going on 45 now. I can write songs without a prob. I have friend really into theory and they're some technical, amazing fuckers. But they're creativity is lame. There's one talented progressive metal dude that writes 30 minute epics that don't go anywhere..and you're begging to please make it stop. That's fucked up.

Sorry for the ramble or typos..I'm actually really baked right now. So, I'm doin' good.

This is the word of Bill. Praise be to Bill.
He speaks the truth bro. I have been playing since 13 and I am 47. I am also a classically trained pianist. I was a child prodigy at age 10 because I could play Bethovens Moonlight Sonata by ear. My teacher tried to teach me theory and he eventually gave up and would just record himself playing the piece and I would just listen to it and be able to play it for our next "lesson". I also played clarinet at the time from 3rd grade all the way up to 10th grade in HS. Check this out... I was 1st clarinet in our very successful marching band and orchestra and I got thrown out because I couldn't read music. The teacher caught me at rehearsal one day when he surprised us with a new piece. He handed the music to all the first clarinets and I just sat there and let them play. I made up the excuse that I had a key sticking. After hearing them play it once I was able to nail it the next time around. He new something was up and I came clean. He told me I needed to know theory and be able to read in order to stay in both band and orchestra. I told him that I never knew how to read and I have been 1st clarinet since the 3rd grade. He didn't care. I told him to fuck off and thats when I started my 1st metal band. Mike Matevich from Stealheart was my first lead singer. I thank that music teacher in my mind everytime I pick up my guitar.

[Endrik]

dude, sounds like you are out of ideas and perhaps tend to play the same things over and over again so it starts to bore you and whatnot?

nothing wrong being self taught... it's just maybe using tabs have stopped your ear development I think.... if you wanna completely change your approach... start by using your ears only... it's by far the most important thing... if your ears are working well you can do pretty much everything.

as far as music theory goes... it doesn't hurt... a lot of people who are stuck somewhere try to find help in music theory because to many knowing theory helps to map out the fretboard and the relationship between chords and scales and whatnot so there would be more logical options for them.

but I gotta tell you if your ears are sharp you'll forget the theory, you instinctively know where to go... the whole fretboard is mapped out in your head but way more complexly than the theory allows... you have no limits... your ears lead you... what interval to play next an whatnot

btw. completely changing approach means breaking all the mental boundaries... it's not just some step by step program.

for example if you pick up your guitar... you usually play some very comfortable thing first... but why not doing he exact opposite... as soon as you take the guitar... play the most uncomfortable, craziest thing you can imagine... use the most difficult finger positions and whatnot.
it's all about breaking the boundaries... the guitar doesn't electrocute you because you put your fingers in different positions.
start experimenting... trying all kinds of fingerings, positions, intervals and whatnot... there's no wrong notes... you just have to learn how to use them so they would sound cool. if you do that all the time you ears will develop so you can play some cool and different sounding licks any time.

but the most important thing is how to play the notes.... in my opinion it doesn't matter what you play nearly as much as how you play.
there's so much nuances in music, it's all about the feel and the emotion behind what you play.
there's so much different music made, we in western world may not even realise how much depth some other cultures have in their music.
there's so much you can do rhythmically.. why just play everything with even 16th notes... why not playing everything with different lengths... with different breaks... or why not against the rhythm..
why not bending or vibrating the notes differently... emulating some exotic instrument or a singer.
why not playing the notes with different attack, technique... with fingers or whatnot... with dynamics you can bring out so many different colors.
some drone type of music often have only one note played for a long time... like some Aborigen music... but how they vary the length of the note, the intensity, the dynamics and tone is just mind blowing and it can put people into trance... it proves that playing only one note for a long can be very interesting.. as I said it's all about how you play.

knowing music theory is good but what's even more important and useful is the anthropological concept... theory of why different people play like the do... what emotions, social and cultural aspects are behind it.

listening to a lot of different music will give you ideas and when creating your own music letting go all the previous mental boxes will help you make something cool and colourful as the things you are listening to.

Tony Levin is in my opinion one of the most creative and unique bassists/musicians ever. He has such a distinct style and he always surprises me... even today. It's because he doesn't have any boundaries.. he constantly tries new things.
He started as a classically trained upright bass player, then got into electric bass playing mostly jazz, blues and rock. But he constantly took ideas from all kinds of different world music, he tried different rhythmic placements for notes, trying pluck the strings in different positions or hit with fingernails or drumsticks etc etc. and he still does it. That's why has created so much innovational music, ideas and techniques.

[nhspike]

Some great information/thoughts/approaches in this thread.
I don't have much to add other than we all hit musical plateaus.
Sometimes they last for a while, even years.
I say keep driving, keep playing, mix it up like you are about to do, and in the other ways that the brothers here have suggested... but keep driving.
Out of the blue, you will bounce up to a new level, and the view will change.
The way you view the song, the way you view the fretboad, and the way you interact with it.
It will be fresh, and you will look down on your previous playing as a required step that got you to this level.
You may actually bounce a few levels up in style, speed, or technique.

Keep driving.

Keep those fingers moving, and challenged.

Oh, and don't forget to enjoy it... don't loose the fun.

Congrats on your determination!

[triplehold]

Yes! No one could have said it better than these guys. 6 strings, 12 notes and and a lifetime to master, just keep jammin' and don't sweat it. Going to see some live bands always helps. I always pictured guitar playing as an infinite staircase. You are on the "I suck" tread and you step up to the "Hey, I'm getting good" tread, then the next step is the "I suck" tread again. I remember years ago when Joe Satriani first busted out on the music scene, in an interview in one of the guitar mags, he was asked what he does if he is in a creative funk. He said he goes to the grocery store and checks out the produce department and gets inspiration there. Anything can do it, but I have always remembered that one.